It is currently Thu Oct 31, 2024 4:55 pm

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 18 posts ] 
Author Message
Offline
 Post subject: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #1 Posted: Fri Jun 10, 2016 11:27 am 
Lives in sente

Posts: 727
Liked others: 44
Was liked: 218
GD Posts: 10
At KGS 5 dan this is the strongest free go AI, but it's the engine only so you still need an interface to play with it.

https://github.com/facebookresearch/dar ... /README.md


This post by pookpooi was liked by: emeraldemon
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #2 Posted: Fri Jun 10, 2016 11:44 am 
Lives with ko

Posts: 161
Liked others: 2
Was liked: 25
pookpooi wrote:
At KGS 5 dan this is the strongest free go AI, but it's the engine only so you still need an interface to play with it.

https://github.com/facebookresearch/dar ... /README.md


Ehh... conundrum.

I really *really* dislike Facebook. The service, the company... everything. But I like Go.

Should I have a 'go' at compiling this engine after I'm done testing Oakfoam or not? Hmpf... it's not going to be very easy because I don't know any of the dependencies :P I wonder if the mentioned Torch framework needs to be installed on the computer that is going to run DarkForest, or if it's going to be built into the program. If it has to be installed, it's going to become a difficult affair.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #3 Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2016 6:40 pm 
Dies with sente

Posts: 101
Liked others: 2
Was liked: 16
Rank: KGS 2 D
Looks like you need to have the basic hardware first. This software must run on a GPU with a lots of CUDA cores.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #4 Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 3:57 am 
Lives with ko

Posts: 161
Liked others: 2
Was liked: 25
splee99 wrote:
Looks like you need to have the basic hardware first. This software must run on a GPU with a lots of CUDA cores.


I have a CUDA-capable card. Maybe not the most powerful card in the universe, but it has 1024 cores. I'll assume it's enough to get the program to run at least.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #5 Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 4:51 am 
Lives with ko

Posts: 129
Liked others: 20
Was liked: 17
Ha Babel, I just PMed you to point you here and now I realized, you are already here :D
I have a GTX970 and i7_2600k and I think (not sure any more) in Hirataku engine both versions (GPU/CPU) were about the same fast on my computer. So it may be worth a compile.,...

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #6 Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 7:56 am 
Beginner

Posts: 1
Liked others: 0
Was liked: 0
Rank: KGS 3 kyu
Babelardus wrote:
splee99 wrote:
Looks like you need to have the basic hardware first. This software must run on a GPU with a lots of CUDA cores.


I have a CUDA-capable card. Maybe not the most powerful card in the universe, but it has 1024 cores. I'll assume it's enough to get the program to run at least.


Believe it or not, for NN work, number of cores is not the primary requirement, it's memory bandwith. This said, I'm going to work on compiling this baby on my i7-4770K / GTX680 SLI machine.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #7 Posted: Thu Jun 16, 2016 11:02 pm 
Dies in gote

Posts: 21
Liked others: 1
Was liked: 9
Rank: 3k
KGS: kgsnick
Hi all!

Anyone can compile this project for Windows?

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #8 Posted: Thu Jun 16, 2016 11:54 pm 
Lives with ko

Posts: 161
Liked others: 2
Was liked: 25
I wonder if Torch 7 can be installed on Windows. I also don't have any experience with the other dependencies this engine has. I don't even know if it can stand on its own, without having to install anything else, after it's compiled.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #9 Posted: Fri Jun 17, 2016 1:49 pm 
Lives in gote
User avatar

Posts: 329
Location: Denmark
Liked others: 4
Was liked: 65
Rank: 6D Tygem
Universal go server handle: pluspy
If someone could make this available for use by laymen such as myself, it would be much appreciated. I'm not lazy, I'm willing to do some work, but I've got no clue how to go about getting this thing playable. I'm curious to play it and see how strong it is vs Leela and Crazystone for example.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #10 Posted: Fri Jun 17, 2016 1:56 pm 
Lives with ko

Posts: 161
Liked others: 2
Was liked: 25
I'll take a look at this tomorrow, but I can't promise that I'll be able to get it usable on Windows.

To be really honest, I don't see a good chance to get this engine playable in a reasonable amount of time. For one, it uses dependencies I have no experience with, and I'm not even sure about some of them being able to compile and run on Windows.

This post on one of the development lists says outright that Torch 7 isn't supported on Windows. If that is true, and the package can't be just downloaded and compiled, then it's over already. I can't port Torch to Windows. I don't have the time nor the knowledge regarding machine learning. (I could, for example, try to fix Pachi, so it doesn't hang when compiled with MinGW on Windows, but even things like that require too much time to get done, without thoroughly knowing the program's code.)

While I could install a Linux virtual machine with a full development environment and compile the engine there, that would take even more time. Additionally, it would become a huge engine, as I'd need to statically compile everything into the DarkForest binary, to get it to run on all Linux systems without needing users to install a lot of libraries, which may, or may not be available for their distribution.

As Cygwin has served me well to get software running on Windows that normally will only compile on Linux, I'll try that.


This post by Babelardus was liked by: gamesorry
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #11 Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2016 3:59 pm 
Oza
User avatar

Posts: 2221
Location: Germany
Liked others: 8263
Was liked: 924
Rank: OGS 9k
OGS: trohde
Universal go server handle: trohde
Quoting from Yuangdong Tian’s latest mail to the “computer-go” mailing list:

Quote:
DarkForest training code is open source now. Hopefully it will help the community.
https://github.com/facebookresearch/darkforestGo

_________________
“The only difference between me and a madman is that I’m not mad.” — Salvador Dali ★ Play a slooooow correspondence game with me on OGS? :)

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #12 Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2016 8:18 am 
Lives in gote
User avatar

Posts: 310
Location: Deutschland
Liked others: 272
Was liked: 126
Rank: EGF 4 kyu
I wonder what the full CUDA requirements are. I have a GTX 780 but that's only "compute capability" SM30 and I have already exceeded that in my own experimentation. (Specifically, SM 3.0 isn't high enough for Dynamic Parallelism - the ability to launch kernels from the GPU itself. I would not be surprised at all if this thing needed that, or newer CUDA features.)

I tried to find the answer but it isn't listed in the README and Google didn't yield it. Unfortunately, my GPU won't work under Linux on my machine, for no apparent reason, so I can't just try and find out.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #13 Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2016 8:52 am 
Beginner

Posts: 11
Liked others: 0
Was liked: 2
Rank: ogs 12kyu
Universal go server handle: qianyilong
Charlie wrote:
I wonder what the full CUDA requirements are.


3.5 Is what I believe the required cuda compute capability is.

source:
http://timdettmers.com/2014/08/14/which ... -learning/ Note: the blog post date of 2014 is deceiving. Tim regularly updates that post as new GPUs come out and replies to the all the comments so it is up to date.


This post by qianyilong was liked by 2 people: ez4u, jeromie
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #14 Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 1:25 am 
Dies in gote

Posts: 69
Location: Connecticut, USA
Liked others: 0
Was liked: 5
Rank: DGS 9 kyu
DGS: Shoreline
OGS: Shoreline
Just report to all of you guys that Facebook dark forest go is a disappointment for me. I expect it to be a strong amateur dan level AI, but instead,
I think it is quite weak. Based on my testing, it is only a strong kyu level in my setting ( dual core, GTX 1050 GPU) by playing
against 2 DGS bots internally. Facebook dark forest go lost all the games against both in my testing in 4 even games.
Here are 2 bots that I tested against dark forest go:

http://www.dragongoserver.net/userinfo.php?uid=97704

http://www.dragongoserver.net/userinfo.php?uid=97511

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #15 Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 3:50 am 
Dies in gote

Posts: 34
Liked others: 0
Was liked: 10
Shoreline wrote:
Just report to all of you guys that Facebook dark forest go is a disappointment for me. I expect it to be a strong amateur dan level AI, but instead,
I think it is quite weak.


https://arxiv.org/pdf/1511.06410.pdf

"The distributed version, named darkfmcts3 in KGS Go Server, use darkfores2 as the underlying DCNN model, runs 75000 rollouts on 2048 threads and produces a move every 13 seconds with one Intel Xeon E5-2680 v2 at 2.80GHz and 44 NVidia K40m GPUs. It uses top-3 predictions in the first 140 moves and switched to top-5 afterwards so that MCTS could have more choices. Pondering is used. Dynamic komi is used only for high handicap games (≥H5). darkfmcts3 now holds a stable KGS 5d level."

I am not sure what "2048 threads" means because Xeon E5-2680v2 is a 16 thread machine. Maybe they meant 128 cores? That would make more sense as I don't see how you can fit 44 GPUs in one machine.

If that is true, it means it is 5 dan with 128 cores and 44 GPUs. So it is not surprising that with your hardware it is very weak. Maybe AlphaGo would be disappointing as well.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #16 Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 7:19 am 
Beginner

Posts: 12
Liked others: 1
Was liked: 4
Rank: 12k KGS or 15k DGS
KGS: wauske
DGS: wauske
Online playing schedule: 20:00-22:00 CET
Garf wrote:
Shoreline wrote:
Just report to all of you guys that Facebook dark forest go is a disappointment for me. I expect it to be a strong amateur dan level AI, but instead,
I think it is quite weak.


https://arxiv.org/pdf/1511.06410.pdf

"The distributed version, named darkfmcts3 in KGS Go Server, use darkfores2 as the underlying DCNN model, runs 75000 rollouts on 2048 threads and produces a move every 13 seconds with one Intel Xeon E5-2680 v2 at 2.80GHz and 44 NVidia K40m GPUs. It uses top-3 predictions in the first 140 moves and switched to top-5 afterwards so that MCTS could have more choices. Pondering is used. Dynamic komi is used only for high handicap games (≥H5). darkfmcts3 now holds a stable KGS 5d level."

I am not sure what "2048 threads" means because Xeon E5-2680v2 is a 16 thread machine. Maybe they meant 128 cores? That would make more sense as I don't see how you can fit 44 GPUs in one machine.

If that is true, it means it is 5 dan with 128 cores and 44 GPUs. So it is not surprising that with your hardware it is very weak. Maybe AlphaGo would be disappointing as well.

A CPU has threads so 2048 indicates a large number of CPU's. A single CPU can have multiple cores and a core can have multiple threads (by way of Intels Hyperthreading). A system can also have multiple CPU's.
A thread can be seen as a train of thought, having multiple threads means you can think of as many things at the same time.

2048 threads is most likely a cluster of servers though, used by way of distributed computing where the workload is spread among multiple systems for increased efficiency vs lower cost (10 servers with cumulative specs are cheaper than 1 with the same sum of specs).

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #17 Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 3:18 pm 
Dies in gote

Posts: 69
Location: Connecticut, USA
Liked others: 0
Was liked: 5
Rank: DGS 9 kyu
DGS: Shoreline
OGS: Shoreline
wauske wrote:
Garf wrote:
Shoreline wrote:
Just report to all of you guys that Facebook dark forest go is a disappointment for me. I expect it to be a strong amateur dan level AI, but instead,
I think it is quite weak.


https://arxiv.org/pdf/1511.06410.pdf

"The distributed version, named darkfmcts3 in KGS Go Server, use darkfores2 as the underlying DCNN model, runs 75000 rollouts on 2048 threads and produces a move every 13 seconds with one Intel Xeon E5-2680 v2 at 2.80GHz and 44 NVidia K40m GPUs. It uses top-3 predictions in the first 140 moves and switched to top-5 afterwards so that MCTS could have more choices. Pondering is used. Dynamic komi is used only for high handicap games (≥H5). darkfmcts3 now holds a stable KGS 5d level."

I am not sure what "2048 threads" means because Xeon E5-2680v2 is a 16 thread machine. Maybe they meant 128 cores? That would make more sense as I don't see how you can fit 44 GPUs in one machine.

If that is true, it means it is 5 dan with 128 cores and 44 GPUs. So it is not surprising that with your hardware it is very weak. Maybe AlphaGo would be disappointing as well.

A CPU has threads so 2048 indicates a large number of CPU's. A single CPU can have multiple cores and a core can have multiple threads (by way of Intels Hyperthreading). A system can also have multiple CPU's.
A thread can be seen as a train of thought, having multiple threads means you can think of as many things at the same time.

2048 threads is most likely a cluster of servers though, used by way of distributed computing where the workload is spread among multiple systems for increased efficiency vs lower cost (10 servers with cumulative specs are cheaper than 1 with the same sum of specs).


I did not pay attention that Facebook dark forest go requires that much computer resource. If darkforstgo only achieve KGS 5d with 2048 threads, that is not impressive at all. I think alphago would do much better in that setting.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Facebook Go AI DarkForest is open source now
Post #18 Posted: Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:28 pm 
Dies in gote

Posts: 69
Location: Connecticut, USA
Liked others: 0
Was liked: 5
Rank: DGS 9 kyu
DGS: Shoreline
OGS: Shoreline
I should take back what I said before on Facebook AI. Facebook had recent bug fix and obviously the strength has been restored. My new testing
on 5000 rollout per move setting put DarkforestGo at some where around DGS 3 Dan level. This would put DarkforestGo at 3rd strongest open source
go AI behind RN3.9 and NG06.

Here is my Darkforest Bot robot account at DGS:
http://www.dragongoserver.net/userinfo.php?uid=98326


This post by Shoreline was liked by: gamesorry
Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 18 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group