It is currently Thu Oct 31, 2024 4:36 pm

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 627 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 32  Next
Author Message
Offline
 Post subject: Teamovitch #1
Post #1 Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:44 pm 
Lives in gote
User avatar

Posts: 588
Location: NY
Liked others: 124
Was liked: 46
Rank: 2D KGS
I've taken the liberty of editing the first post to stick the rules in - hope that's ok :) -- topazg

Teams:

topazg (White)
--------------
Redundant (2k)
chew (4k)
tj86430 (7k)

Joaz (Black)
------------
Jedo (2k)
ben/fwiffo (3/4k)
Jordus (9k)

----------------------------

Rules:

There are three weaker players in each team, maybe 4k-10k or something, who have to nominate their move, and why. When the captain picks the move, he has to discuss his opinion of the pros/cons of each of three moves, and can only pick one of the three suggested. Play then moves to the other team, and it repeats. The captains do not nominate a move, just pick one nominated by the rest of the team.

To keep the game moving, any member can suggest sequences / josekis etc that are behind their thoughts, and provided the game continues along the relevant line each subsequent move can be assumed to be their given nomination unless they say otherwise.

All posts should be viewable by all members of the team, but not the opposing team. It's up to you whether you look at your team mates' posts or not, and up to the captain how much info he gives about future plans or not. The idea is to be educational and informative, not to win at all costs, so strike that balance as it suits you best. For my part I will probably respond with thoughts and potential alternative variations to consider for each of my soldier's proposals, and explain the sort of things I'm aiming for with my choice. I'm may put full expected continuations in my variations, and if I do, I'll put it in a separate hide tag with "not for the rest of my team" as the heading designed not to give anything away to my army. Otherwise, it's fairly standard Malkovich fare.

----------------------------------

Ok everyone, here's the first teamovitch game! As I'm playing Black on Joaz's team, I'll put in my suggestion now. Rules are in this thread: viewtopic.php?f=38&t=2064

Suggestion for move 1:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Move1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I like opening on the 5-3, if for no other reason than that's it's interesting. But there are some main developments to aim for:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c jabberwok
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This is one way it might develop and I am very happy with this formation for black. If white attempts to disrupt it by approach one of the corners instead of taking an empty one, I am happy tenuking and taking a 3rd corner. Assuming white lets this happen though, heres what might transpire:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c jabberwok
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . a . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . b , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 . . . . . , . . . . . , 5 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


If White takes A, I am thrilled to take B and press white down. So we should assume that white will take B, but this seems fine too:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c jabberwok
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , 8 . . . 2 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 7 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . 9 . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Here we get solid points in the upper right and sente to expand the lower right so this seems good too. Let's go for it!

And I'm assuming no referring to joseki or databases

_________________
"There are no limits. There are plateaus, but you must not stay there, you must go beyond them. If it kills you, it kills you. A man must constantly exceed his level." -- Bruce Lee


Last edited by Jedo on Sun Oct 24, 2010 1:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #2 Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:51 pm 
Site Admin
User avatar

Posts: 1125
Location: Allegan, MI, USA
Liked others: 18
Was liked: 121
Rank: KGS 9k
Universal go server handle: Jordus
When did we decide which team is black and which is white?

_________________
I'm thinking...

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #3 Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:58 pm 
Lives in gote
User avatar

Posts: 588
Location: NY
Liked others: 124
Was liked: 46
Rank: 2D KGS
Topazg did in the other thread. Also, I'm assuming 6.5 Komi.

_________________
"There are no limits. There are plateaus, but you must not stay there, you must go beyond them. If it kills you, it kills you. A man must constantly exceed his level." -- Bruce Lee

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #4 Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 1:06 pm 
Site Admin
User avatar

Posts: 1125
Location: Allegan, MI, USA
Liked others: 18
Was liked: 121
Rank: KGS 9k
Universal go server handle: Jordus
So my move #1 then...

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Move1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I chose this because it is versatile and the beginning of a chinese fuseki I favor...

Thee 4-4 point allows you to be more flexible in choosing an opening no matter what white decides to play...

example Chinese (low):

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Move1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Example 2 Another opening:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Move1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , 3 . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Example 3.. cross opening
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Move1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 3 . . . . . , . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

_________________
I'm thinking...

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #5 Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 2:23 pm 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 1435
Location: California
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 171
Rank: Out of practice
GD Posts: 1104
KGS: fwiffo
My preference is for Jordus's 4-4, which is the first move for all my favorite openings. But to provide another option:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Move1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

It can lead to nice openings like Orthodox, Chinese, mini-Chinese and variants, Kobayashi, or whatever.

_________________
KGS 4 kyu - Game Archive - Keyboard Otaku

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1 Move #1
Post #6 Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 4:46 pm 
Judan
User avatar

Posts: 5546
Location: Banbeck Vale
Liked others: 1104
Was liked: 1456
Rank: 1D AGA
GD Posts: 1512
Kaya handle: Test
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Move1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


For observers and teammates:
Any standard corner opening move is fine with me. Since 2 of 3 prefer the hoshi, we'll do it.

_________________
Help make L19 more organized. Make an index: https://lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=5207

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #7 Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 9:26 pm 
Lives in sente
User avatar

Posts: 924
Location: Pittsburgh
Liked others: 45
Was liked: 103
Rank: lazy
KGS: redundant/silchas
Tygem: redundant
Wbaduk: redundant
DGS: redundant
OGS: redundant
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Move2
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , 2 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Let's invite the diagonal fuseki, so we can have an interesting game. If black declines the diagonal, let's play opposing komoku.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 3 . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 4 , . . . . . , . . . . . , 2 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #8 Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 9:50 pm 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 2060
Location: Texas
Liked others: 546
Was liked: 173
Rank: KGS 3k
GD Posts: 264
KGS: Chew
Go team white:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Move1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I like Red's suggestion, but I'll throw this in as well. I agree with the idea of diagonal fuseki, as it tends to be fun and I think that we can outplay them in early complications. Personally, I am better at fuseki than I am at midgame, so let's pose interesting direction-of-play questions as soon as we can. This 5-3 stone seems to work well with an approach against the top right, for what it's worth.

_________________
Someday I want to be strong enough to earn KGS[-].

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #9 Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 12:28 am 
Gosei

Posts: 1348
Location: Finland
Liked others: 49
Was liked: 129
Rank: FGA 7k GoR 1297
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Move2
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Since we have two proposals inviting diagonal fuseki, I feel it is my duty to give our captain a chance to choose a more peaceful game as well. Besides, my natural style is very peaceful, so this is what I would probably play in real life. I'm most familiar with 4-4 josekis, so I tend to play that a lot.

_________________
Offending ad removed

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #10 Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 1:37 am 
Tengen
User avatar

Posts: 4511
Location: Chatteris, UK
Liked others: 1589
Was liked: 656
Rank: Nebulous
GD Posts: 918
KGS: topazg
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm2 Move 2
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


To my whole team:

Ooh, funny how much excitement there can be picking our first move. I like red's idea of tempting the diagonal fuseki, because they are always sort of fun and interesting, and I really like the idea of avoiding too much theoretical bookness. Tj's move feels solid, but I don't want to let Black get a standard Chinese thing going on, because as people know those sort of irritate me :D

There's nothing wrong with any of the three moves here, so this is purely flavour difference. I want something outside of the box, interesting, thought-provoking, and a great learning environment, so I'm going to go with chew's 5-3 as it leaves the most opportunities for bizarre fuseki branching.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm2 Move 2
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This is the sort of fun that can appear on the right hand side, making all Black approaches a bit uncomfortable in the lower right. Time will tell.

If Black plays a 3-4, maybe we should approach that instead of take the last corner? Depends where it is, but let's make the game spicy :)

More objective sequential evaluation will come I promise, but this early part is the psychological game: "Take the bar where you like, we're gonna raise it some anyway"

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #11 Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 6:29 am 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 1435
Location: California
Liked others: 53
Was liked: 171
Rank: Out of practice
GD Posts: 1104
KGS: fwiffo
My suggestion for move 3

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Move 3
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This is my favorite way to go, and lets us go with a mini-Chinese or orthodox next. White has chosen to do something more unusual, but theres no need to go out of our way to contest that.

_________________
KGS 4 kyu - Game Archive - Keyboard Otaku

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #12 Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 7:48 am 
Lives in gote
User avatar

Posts: 588
Location: NY
Liked others: 124
Was liked: 46
Rank: 2D KGS
Edit, my suggestion for move 3, which i just changed:
Edited again for more explanation :)
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm2 Suggestion
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Think going for the diagonal fuseki would really help us, as our 5,3 would lean right towards white's, giving us an ideal approach to the bottom right and prevents white's stone from taking part in building a framework, something the 5-3 is good at doing.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm2 Move 2
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 3 . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . a . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 9 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 . O . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , 0 . . . 4 7 . . . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . . . . . . . . . 6 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I think an opening like this would be very comfortable for black. And again, if white decides to approach us right away, we can coalmy tenuki and take the last corner. Other wise:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm2 Move 2
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . c . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 3 . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . f . . . . . . . . . . . . . d . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . e . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . b . . . . . . . . . . X . O . . |
$$ | . . a , . . . . . , X . . . X O . . . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . . . . . . . . . X O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

A will get pressed down, b gives us a lot of points, and all of these including c will give us sente to approach at e. If white plays d then we will get sente to approach at f and build a large framework.

_________________
"There are no limits. There are plateaus, but you must not stay there, you must go beyond them. If it kills you, it kills you. A man must constantly exceed his level." -- Bruce Lee


Last edited by Jedo on Mon Oct 25, 2010 2:27 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #13 Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 8:23 am 
Lives in gote
User avatar

Posts: 412
Location: Xi'an
Liked others: 11
Was liked: 23
Rank: 7k
Interesting. will be more interesting when it comes to the mid game, i guess.

Maybe team members can put short tag on top of it's hidden suggestion. I think when later there are more observations, i might be confused with if it's a move is by someone in the team or it's a suggestion from an outside observer.

_________________
长考出臭棋.


Last edited by kokomi on Mon Oct 25, 2010 8:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #14 Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 8:26 am 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 2060
Location: Texas
Liked others: 546
Was liked: 173
Rank: KGS 3k
GD Posts: 264
KGS: Chew
kokomi wrote:
Interesting. will be more interesting when it comes to the mid game, i guess.
I'm a bit confused with who's in which team when reading the post, but it doesn't matter who's black or white.


Good point. I'll try to put a "Team white" or something outside of my hide tags, so that it's obvious to observers who spend less time with this game than we do. I know I got confused a few times about the players on the rengo Malkovich.

_________________
Someday I want to be strong enough to earn KGS[-].

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #15 Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 8:32 am 
Lives in gote
User avatar

Posts: 412
Location: Xi'an
Liked others: 11
Was liked: 23
Rank: 7k
Chew Terr wrote:
kokomi wrote:
Interesting. will be more interesting when it comes to the mid game, i guess.
I'm a bit confused with who's in which team when reading the post, but it doesn't matter who's black or white.


Good point. I'll try to put a "Team white" or something outside of my hide tags, so that it's obvious to observers who spend less time with this game than we do. I know I got confused a few times about the players on the rengo Malkovich.


you read out what i thought :bow: I have thought that my first post was not clear enough to express what I meant so tried to edit it a bit. :-)

_________________
长考出臭棋.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #16 Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 8:33 am 
Lives in sente
User avatar

Posts: 924
Location: Pittsburgh
Liked others: 45
Was liked: 103
Rank: lazy
KGS: redundant/silchas
Tygem: redundant
Wbaduk: redundant
DGS: redundant
OGS: redundant
Team white internal chat:
What kind of style do we want to play? Are we going to be territorial or influential? Fighting?

I usually play with a pretty territorial style, but I'm willing to try anything.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #17 Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 8:40 am 
Tengen
User avatar

Posts: 4511
Location: Chatteris, UK
Liked others: 1589
Was liked: 656
Rank: Nebulous
GD Posts: 918
KGS: topazg
Team White internal chat:

We become water: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzLhiWd9Efw

We sit on Black. We make them squirm and crawl. We tell them that we won't let them breathe, we won't give them space to think, and we won't let them think that moving first will help them. When they show their hand, we adapt and crush them!

Nicely, of course :)


This post by topazg was liked by: Redundant
Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #18 Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 8:42 am 
Lives in gote
User avatar

Posts: 412
Location: Xi'an
Liked others: 11
Was liked: 23
Rank: 7k
Redundant wrote:
Team white internal chat:
What kind of style do we want to play? Are we going to be territorial or influential? Fighting?

I usually play with a pretty territorial style, but I'm willing to try anything.


For observers only
Good question. Remind me of my freshman team work workshop. Will team black ask the same question soon? This game is becoming more interesting not only on game itself.

_________________
长考出臭棋.

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #19 Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 8:45 am 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 2060
Location: Texas
Liked others: 546
Was liked: 173
Rank: KGS 3k
GD Posts: 264
KGS: Chew
White Internal:
Ask me in ten moves! We'll see by the next few moves how black encloses corners, then we'll know what weaknesses/approaches have been left. If black is so kind as to give us a 3-4, we can apporach, and see how it goes from there. For example, if we get an early taisha (like if B comes under our 5-3), then we can likely take outside thickness. I like the idea of having a plan, but I'd say it's too early to commit.

_________________
Someday I want to be strong enough to earn KGS[-].

Top
 Profile  
 
Offline
 Post subject: Re: Teamovitch #1
Post #20 Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:50 am 
Site Admin
User avatar

Posts: 1125
Location: Allegan, MI, USA
Liked others: 18
Was liked: 121
Rank: KGS 9k
Universal go server handle: Jordus
Move #3

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm1 Move 3
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . 3 , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Decisions decisions....
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm2 Move 2
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . c , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . b . . . . . , . . . d a , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

I thought about playing a, though I usually only see white make moves like that..., and jedo chose b... I favor C because of the chinese(low) opening...D give a more passive approach to that corner... I think I will choose A since Fwiffo presented the option for an orthodox and mini chinese opening... By choosing a we can take this corner or, if coming out of the conflict with seki, we can get an advantage in the other unplayed corner...

_________________
I'm thinking...

Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 627 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 32  Next

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group