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 Post subject: Re: Fuseki changes that make the usual books obsolete?
Post #41 Posted: Thu Jun 20, 2013 6:57 am 
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One characteristic that seems to dominate current top level Korean play is risk, which appears to be a response to the ultra-orthodox play with its simple conventional fusekis and excruciating endgame tesuji dominating the 1990's. And phrases such as "bad for black " and "risky for black" could easily be misinterpreted, leading to confusion when seeing top level players doing things that aren't recommended in our books on fuseki fundamentals from the 1970's and 1980's.

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 Post subject: Re: Fuseki changes that make the usual books obsolete?
Post #42 Posted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 5:51 am 
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This is a follow-up to the discussion earlier about the 'correct' direction to approach the corner.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm25
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . a . b . O . . . O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . # O O . |
$$ | . . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . O . . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]

This game is from today's Chinese League between Fan Tingyu and Park Jungwhan (the winner and runner-up of Ing Cup, full record at http://www.go4go.net/go/games/sgfview/34436). This game is very similar to the one from Chunlan Cup final (the only difference is the location of :bs:). :b25: approached from this side (instead of invading at 'a' or 'b' to make use of the wall). As I explained earlier, the strategy of approaching from wider side is very reasonable. It was approved one more time by top pros.

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 Post subject: Re: Fuseki changes that make the usual books obsolete?
Post #43 Posted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 7:47 am 
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macelee wrote:
This is a follow-up to the discussion earlier about the 'correct' direction to approach the corner.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm25
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . a . b . O . . . O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . # O O . |
$$ | . . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . X X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . O . . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]

This game is from today's Chinese League between Fan Tingyu and Park Jungwhan (the winner and runner-up of Ing Cup, full record at http://www.go4go.net/go/games/sgfview/34436). This game is very similar to the one from Chunlan Cup final (the only difference is the location of :bs:). :b25: approached from this side (instead of invading at 'a' or 'b' to make use of the wall). As I explained earlier, the strategy of approaching from wider side is very reasonable. It was approved one more time by top pros.


Which emphasizes the point that the pros have not "stopped following" textbook rules. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Fuseki changes that make the usual books obsolete?
Post #44 Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 2:28 am 
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Bill Spight wrote:
Which emphasizes the point that the pros have not "stopped following" textbook rules. :)


I cannot see the logic here.

When I first said :b25: approaching from wide side is traditional wisdom. You disagreed.

You said: "The approach from the left side invites a White extension on the top side, which helps the White formation there. That, in turn, makes it more difficult for Black to make use of his thickness in the top right. To make use of that thickness the approach cum invasion on the top side is urgent, as indicated."

Then when I gave an example counter your argument, you said that my example emphasized your point. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Fuseki changes that make the usual books obsolete?
Post #45 Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 2:49 am 
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Edit: Ah I see you are already talking about Chen Yaoye - Lee Sedol game. I was going to say this reminded me of that :)

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 Post subject: Re: Fuseki changes that make the usual books obsolete?
Post #46 Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 3:35 am 
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Having all the discussions, we use conventional wisdom as guidance. But Go is really flexible and there are often more possibilities than that can be covered by books. See how two young players handle this situation. Full game at http://www.go4go.net/go/games/sgfview/34471

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bm25 Guo Wenchao (b) vs. Yang Dingxin (w)
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . 4 . . . . . O X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O . . . O X X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . 5 . . 1 2 . . . X . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 3 7 . . . . . . O O . |
$$ | . . . 6 . . . . . . . . . . . X X X . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . O . . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]

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