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 Post subject: Re: Winning Mindset
Post #21 Posted: Wed May 13, 2015 12:35 am 
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I haven't read the thread in detail, so my points may have emerged already one way or the other. But the two most effective ways to get better concentration (apart from trying to concentrate more and more often) are:

1. Meditation: About 20 minutes every day are enough to help you to focus on the moment. In Go, at work, during conversations, etc. You can do it freestyle. Sitting down comfortable but not slack, focussing on your breath, trying to push every thought gently away. Or you search a Zazen group in your area to do it more seriously.

2. Recreational sport: Go is very exhausting and you need a lot of stamina to sit through hours of thinking. When you listen to Snooker players, they always say how important stamina enhancing sport is for them, as their profession mostly strains their brain. So go jogging, biking or play football, etc. But rather not play chess.


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 Post subject: Re: Winning Mindset
Post #22 Posted: Wed May 13, 2015 7:43 am 
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I have the same problem Kirby described in the OP.

If I'm completely honest, I think it is complexity that eventually gets me. The more stones on the board, the more complex the game is, in general. Later in the game, when I trick myself, I tend to think this chaos / complexity is the reason.

My current solution is counter intuitive, maybe. Rather than trying to simplify the game, I am doing the opposite, cutting when it's remotely reasonable, creating fights and complexity. (Even when leading, which I know is stupid, if winning is what I'm after.)

My rating swiftly declined from 1 dan KGS to 2 kyu. I'm still following the same course, and am back to 1k, and feeling okay about my go. I still often "lose concentration" but no more often than my opponents, I think. And a higher proportion of my games have been great fun.

I probably should have done this at 5k, but better late than never.

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 Post subject: Re: Winning Mindset
Post #23 Posted: Wed May 13, 2015 12:25 pm 
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Akura wrote:
I haven't read the thread in detail, so my points may have emerged already one way or the other. But the two most effective ways to get better concentration (apart from trying to concentrate more and more often) are:

1. Meditation: About 20 minutes every day are enough to help you to focus on the moment. In Go, at work, during conversations, etc. You can do it freestyle. Sitting down comfortable but not slack, focussing on your breath, trying to push every thought gently away. Or you search a Zazen group in your area to do it more seriously.

2. Recreational sport: Go is very exhausting and you need a lot of stamina to sit through hours of thinking. When you listen to Snooker players, they always say how important stamina enhancing sport is for them, as their profession mostly strains their brain. So go jogging, biking or play football, etc. But rather not play chess.



To me playing go is already a form of meditation, and it is much more effective than any other kind of meditation I have tried. I quickly gave up on any meditation that involves "clearing your mind" or trying not to think of anything. It was impossible for me to do so and I have even read stories of monks who succeeded and ended up in a permanent coma for their efforts. So the other kind of meditation is focusing on something specific, like breathing - or go. When I play go I am aware of very little but the board. I cannot hold even simple conversations without deliberately disengaging from the board, and might not even notice if my wife is trying to talk to me. If a movie is on in the background, I experience a time warp when the game is over - not remembering anything that happened during the course of the game. Now I am certainly not saying that traditional meditation would not help others or that it is a bad idea, it was just not for me, and I found the parallels that exist between playing go and meditation interesting.

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Post #24 Posted: Wed May 13, 2015 4:03 pm 
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To me playing go is already a form of meditation,
and it is much more effective than any other kind of meditation I have tried.
Indeed, Go can be an excellent form of meditation.
Other "active" forms include:
In Go, a loss of concentration, even for a fraction of a second,
could mean losing a few stones or the entire game.

In some of the other forms above, it could result in serious injuries or worse.

Part of the reasons some people are attracted to
those forms is the no-nonsense nature:
the feedback is very clear, direct, and immediate: a broken nose, or death.
Precisely for the same reason, they are not for everybody.
Nor is Go. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Winning Mindset
Post #25 Posted: Wed May 13, 2015 11:17 pm 
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If you experience go as meditation, you might not have a concentration problem ;-) . My experience is that meditating is a way of practicing and getting into the habit of a)noticing when my mind drifts, and b) regaining my focus. Since starting, my concentation has improved and my blunder-induced attacks on my self-esteem have decreased. Of course, you mileage may vary.

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Post #26 Posted: Thu May 14, 2015 4:14 am 
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EdLee wrote:
[...]
[...]
In Go, a loss of concentration, even for a fraction of a second,
could mean losing a few stones or the entire game.

In some of the other forms above, it could result in serious injuries or worse.

Part of the reasons some people are attracted to
those forms is the no-nonsense nature:
the feedback is very clear, direct, and immediate: a broken nose, or death.
Precisely for the same reason, they are not for everybody.
Nor is Go. :)


Man, I wished I had the same level of focus and concentration in Go as when I'm racing go-carts. I guess the fear for your life is still greater than the fear to a lose a game of Go : D

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Post #27 Posted: Thu May 14, 2015 9:58 am 
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SoDesuNe wrote:
EdLee wrote:
[...]
[...]
In Go, a loss of concentration, even for a fraction of a second,
could mean losing a few stones or the entire game.

In some of the other forms above, it could result in serious injuries or worse.

Part of the reasons some people are attracted to
those forms is the no-nonsense nature:
the feedback is very clear, direct, and immediate: a broken nose, or death.
Precisely for the same reason, they are not for everybody.
Nor is Go. :)


Man, I wished I had the same level of focus and concentration in Go as when I'm racing go-carts. I guess the fear for your life is still greater than the fear to a lose a game of Go : D


And that's the problem! :).

Go is Serious Business. You must approach every game of go as it will be your last, as if your life depends on it!.

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Post #28 Posted: Thu May 14, 2015 9:59 am 
Oza
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Bki wrote:
SoDesuNe wrote:
EdLee wrote:
[...]
[...]
In Go, a loss of concentration, even for a fraction of a second,
could mean losing a few stones or the entire game.

In some of the other forms above, it could result in serious injuries or worse.

Part of the reasons some people are attracted to
those forms is the no-nonsense nature:
the feedback is very clear, direct, and immediate: a broken nose, or death.
Precisely for the same reason, they are not for everybody.
Nor is Go. :)


Man, I wished I had the same level of focus and concentration in Go as when I'm racing go-carts. I guess the fear for your life is still greater than the fear to a lose a game of Go : D


And that's the problem! :).

Go is Serious Business. You must approach every game of go as it will be your last, as if your life depends on it!.


But it ain't, so we don't. That's the problem.

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Post #29 Posted: Thu May 14, 2015 10:03 am 
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daal wrote:
But it ain't, so we don't. That's the problem.


Well, then try betting an arm, or your house, or your liver, etc... on games. That way you will sure be motivated to win :).

I decline all responsibilities for injuries or illegal actions caused by following my advice.


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Post #30 Posted: Thu May 14, 2015 10:15 am 
Honinbo

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Bki wrote:
daal wrote:
But it ain't, so we don't. That's the problem.


Well, then try betting an arm, or your house, or your liver, etc... on games. That way you will sure be motivated to win :).

I decline all responsibilities for injuries or illegal actions caused by following my advice.


I see. All this time, I was worried about having better concentration, and all I needed to do was put my liver on the line!

A good alternative to drinking!

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 Post subject: Re: Winning Mindset
Post #31 Posted: Thu May 14, 2015 11:36 am 
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This reminds of the Gungi match between the Ant King and Komugi in Hunter x Hunter. Highly recommended!

Yeah, being serious about the game is necessary, but it also depends on the context. A friendly game in a café is something else as a tournament game. Maybe make a bet with a friend: If you lose more games than you win (in a tournament) you pay him 10 bucks. Or you do one push-up per point by which you lose. Or you make a slap bet (c.f. How I Met Your Mother).

But motivation for the game should come from within - which I lack. That's why I quit playing on KGS and in our local game night. I play DGS games, 'cause there I can make a move if and only if I'm in the mood. And in my Go club I mostly teach beginners. Actually, let me elaborate a bit:

Last March I participated in the Hamburg Go Seminar (which doesn't take place in Hamburg) and realized (once again) how much I love Go and how much fun it is. And, most importantly, I realized that it's totally ok to NOT play Go (even though I won most of the games at the seminar). I love studying. At the seminar the Dan player praised me for my tsumego skills; as a 5 kyu I regularly solve 2-4 dan problems. I find it very relaxing to play through professional games and joseki variations. All by myself or with friends - with commentaries or my own silly variations. And I take great delight in teaching.

There are a thousand different ways to "Go". If you lack the motivation to play, don't have enough stamina to sit through several games at a tournament or are discontent with your moves even when you win, do something else than playing.

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Post #32 Posted: Thu May 14, 2015 1:11 pm 
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try betting an arm, or your house, or your liver, etc... on games.
Please, no wagering.(*)






(*) David Letterman, 1980 - May 20, 2015.

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