Life In 19x19 http://www.lifein19x19.com/ |
|
What's the best sequence here? http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=4533 |
Page 1 of 1 |
Author: | Kirby [ Wed Aug 24, 2011 4:22 am ] |
Post subject: | What's the best sequence here? |
Here is a position I came into during a game this morning. I am white: ![]() In the game it turned out OK, I guess, but I have reason to feel that my play is not the best for a couple of reasons: The move above feels great to play. That's why I wanted to play it. But is it really bigger than the area around 'a'? The reason I wonder is, as you can see in the diagrams above, I played two additional moves later to stabilize the three white stones on the left. However, if I do not play the marked move, it seems easy to get an attack on the white stones this way: The second point that I wonder about is if it is worth it to atari, since it gets cut later anyway. In other words, how about this? Above, I omit the atari. This prevents black's cut, and maybe gives me the choice as white to either atari or get sente on the bottom. What do you guys think? |
Author: | Kirby [ Wed Aug 24, 2011 4:26 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: What's the best sequence here? |
One other thing that I forgot to mention: Subsequently in the game, I played this to sacrifice the cutting stone: What do you think of the sequence above? I'm not so sure of it. It's possible that black got more benefit than white did. First, white looks a bit cramped. Second, pushing black from behind along the center seems to give good benefit to black... What do you think? |
Author: | Tryss [ Wed Aug 24, 2011 5:08 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: What's the best sequence here? |
I would have blocked the corner: Compare this to the standart joseki : Sure, J2 is annoying, but white can jump into the center or approach at O3 Disclaimer: this is only my (uninformed) opinion, and I would be glad to be contradicted ![]() |
Author: | malweth [ Wed Aug 24, 2011 5:17 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: What's the best sequence here? |
White has to come back and play 2 at some point anyway, this seems best to me. Bumping at a seems to help black settle. I also think b helps black too much. I would just extend to c. Something like d is left to ruin black's base... and you'll still have the peep at e (which is lost after White's b). |
Author: | Kirby [ Wed Aug 24, 2011 5:17 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: What's the best sequence here? |
@Tryss: This still seems a little attackable: But maybe your idea is best. It does give white more corner territory compared to the other sequence you showed, for example. And, like you said, white can jump into the center in the picture above. |
Author: | Kirby [ Wed Aug 24, 2011 5:20 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: What's the best sequence here? |
malweth wrote: ... Bumping at a seems to help black settle... I suppose that could be true. I felt that playing at 'a' gave black worse shape than the proposed alternative, but maybe this is not as valuable? |
Author: | malweth [ Wed Aug 24, 2011 5:25 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: What's the best sequence here? |
Kirby wrote: malweth wrote: ... Bumping at a seems to help black settle... I suppose that could be true. I felt that playing at 'a' gave black worse shape than the proposed alternative, but maybe this is not as valuable? I'm never too sure about this stuff... In the joseki, B usually takes White's 1 in my diagram, so this is good compensation. Also in the joseki, after this sequence, W to the right of (d) is no longer any good (B responds at (d) instead of one above that point), but it's otherwise unaffected. The Joseki I'm thinking of: |
Author: | gaius [ Wed Aug 24, 2011 6:50 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: What's the best sequence here? |
Your moves in the game look excellent to me. Since ![]() ![]() ![]() No guarantees, but it feels good to me ![]() |
Author: | HermanHiddema [ Wed Aug 24, 2011 7:13 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: What's the best sequence here? |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() I would prefer to play ![]() ![]() |
Author: | Magicwand [ Wed Aug 24, 2011 8:36 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: What's the best sequence here? |
how about below??? FYI, below shape is not good for white... black can play strong and play a-b-c white really dont have any solid answer to that simple sequence.. |
Author: | SoDesuNe [ Wed Aug 24, 2011 2:32 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: What's the best sequence here? |
On GoSensation breakfast concludes the following: White needs to play 'a' or 'b' (defending the corner) before he tries to cut with F2. http://www.gosensations.com/?id=2&serve ... ew_id=1076 |
Author: | Kirby [ Thu Aug 25, 2011 11:25 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: What's the best sequence here? |
gaius wrote: Your moves in the game look excellent to me. Since ![]() ![]() ![]() No guarantees, but it feels good to me ![]() ... Thanks for the commentary, gaius. I think I mostly agree, though, it does feel a bit bad to let black extend (though a fight can erupt). |
Author: | Kirby [ Thu Aug 25, 2011 11:28 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: What's the best sequence here? |
HermanHiddema wrote: :w8: is good, it destroys black's shape, and is certainly better than playing 3-3. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() I would prefer to play ![]() ![]() Thank you for responding. Thank you especially for the comment about ![]() ![]() |
Author: | Kirby [ Thu Aug 25, 2011 11:33 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: What's the best sequence here? |
Magicwand wrote: how about below??? FYI, below shape is not good for white... black can play strong and play a-b-c white really dont have any solid answer to that simple sequence.. Thanks for the comment, Magicwand. The interesting thing is, your proposed 'a', 'b', 'c' is exactly what happened in the game. Subsequent moves allowed for things to work out for me, but I think it's just because black made some mistakes later on. ![]() But let's suppose that, in the game, I missed ![]() What is the best for me to do here? Clearly, it was not good to play as I did during the game. It would have been better to play the ![]() |
Author: | Kirby [ Thu Aug 25, 2011 11:34 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: What's the best sequence here? |
SoDesuNe wrote: .. White needs to play 'a' or 'b' (defending the corner) before he tries to cut with F2. http://www.gosensations.com/?id=2&serve ... ew_id=1076 Thanks, SoDesuNe. It would have been interesting if black had played that way. |
Page 1 of 1 | All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ] |
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group http://www.phpbb.com/ |