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 Post subject: How best to approach teaching game as a student?
Post #1 Posted: Mon Feb 03, 2014 7:40 pm 
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I read something earlier that really struck a chord. It went something like "To get better you have to change the way you are thinking and play people who are thinking differently than you. ie people of higher rank." It made perfect sense. So I thought what better way than to ask for a teaching game from the kind people of KGS (I'm going to be shouting out to you L19ers on KGS soon too, feel free to volunteer in advance :cool: ) So tonight I got my first teaching game in a while.

It was excellent and the instructor was kind and full of information. However I felt I wasn't approaching the teaching game correctly. I found myself sitting back and waiting to be told something, jotting down things here and there I thought I'd was to remember during my next game. Instead of actively trying to obtain information. It felt like I could be doing more but I wasn't exactly sure what else I could be doing.

Is there a mindset/method/paradigm I should be considering when I have the luxury of getting these games? I want to glean as much information as possible from them as my time, like everyone's I'm sure, is finite.

I plan to jot down notes as I get these games and eventually make a study journal here on L19 to share my experiences.

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 Post subject: Re: How best to approach teaching game as a student?
Post #2 Posted: Mon Feb 03, 2014 11:10 pm 
Lives in sente
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When playing a teaching game as the weaker player, I have 3 pieces of advice.

1. Play your usual game

This is the most important thing you can do. If you usually play fast, play fast. If you usually play for influence, play for influence. Don't overthink your plays because you don't want to mess up and don't underthink them because you know you'll be corrected anyway.

Imagine you are playing someone of the same rank. A good teacher will strive not to overwhelm you, so definitely play to win.

If you take handicap stones for the teaching game, that's fine. Again, just try to play normally. If you prefer to back off from approach moves, don't pincer just because you have support stones. If you usually pincer don't back off because you already have free moves.

2. When you make a mistake, learn from it

You are going to make a blunder in the game somewhere that your opponent calls you on. That is a given in a teaching game. So when you do, figure out why the move was bad in an absolute sense. What I mean is - ask questions and look at variations until you understand why your move was bad beyond just this one particular situation. Was it that you attached to a weak stone two moves earlier? Was it that you missed a key tesuji or shape point? Ask your teacher what the root of the mistake is and don't be afraid to probe for a deeper lesson.

The point of a teaching game is to learn. You must learn something applicable from the mistake.

It is up to you and your teacher whether it is best to undo the move, that is debatable and whether it is good depends on how bad the blunder is and other circumstances. Before you undo the move, however, make sure you actually understand why it was a bad move.

3. Be forgiving of your teacher

It is unlikely your teacher will be a professional player who understands every angle of the game. High SDK players vary in their ability at different points of the game. Even dan level amateurs can be very wrong in certain circumstances. You shouldn't blindly follow the advice of an amateur, but don't question everything your teacher says just because you have a different opinion. Remember, they are still better than you - that is why you can learn from them.

If your teacher doesn't know exactly why a move was wrong, that's okay. Accept their inability to help you in that one case, but don't think that just because they don't understand the intricate nature of a rare joseki that they are unable to help your game in general. Good teachers will admit when they can't help you, bad teachers fake knowledge to try to keep you interested. Honestly, a teacher saying "I don't know enough about this" is often a sign you've found a good teacher because their pride isn't leading them to mislead you.

And if you do still want to know the answer to a question your teacher couldn't give you, then when you are done with the game, you can always post it for review here. Ask about the move. Maybe someone will have some insight your teacher lacked.

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"You have to walk before you can run. Black 1 was a walking move.
I blushed inwardly to recall the ignorant thoughts that had gone through
my mind before, when I had not realized the true worth of Black 1."

-Kageyama Toshiro on proper moves

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 Post subject: Re: How best to approach teaching game as a student?
Post #3 Posted: Mon Feb 03, 2014 11:38 pm 
Oza

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I've only one piece of advice, don't be surprised if someone or different people keep bringing up a similar family of mistakes. It's rare that you fix something in your play after the first time you are told it's a mistake (it's actually quite common to stop making that mistake and start making a different one because you didn't really understand why the first one was a mistake). Be prepared for repetition, especially trying out ideas in your games, it can take many, many ranks before something as "simple" as knowing when to invade at 3,3 becomes something firmer in your mind.

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 Post subject: Re: How best to approach teaching game as a student?
Post #4 Posted: Mon Feb 03, 2014 11:57 pm 
Judan

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As a pupil, ask. If you don't know what to ask, then ask the teacher what or how to ask. But don't prevent the teacher from teaching, by posing too many questions at the same time. If the teacher is providing so much and good new information that you do not feel like asking more, tell the teacher that you are learning a lot and want the teacher to continue in his manner. Of course, a teacher should also ask whether the pupil has additional questions.

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Post #5 Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2014 12:16 am 
Honinbo
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Think of every game as a teaching game.


This post by EdLee was liked by 2 people: Bill Spight, Bonobo
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 Post subject: Re: How best to approach teaching game as a student?
Post #6 Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2014 7:45 am 
Lives with ko

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The questions, lessons, instructions, advice, etc. are all good; but I've gotten the most out of just observing my opponents moves in a teaching game.

In a handicap game I reinforce my groups and white reduces them or strikes their vital points. I launch severe attacks with my stone advantage, and white parries them away. These are excellent lessons aimed directly at your own misunderstandings: it's not just the vital point in an arbitrary shape in a tsumego, but the vital point in a shape you thought was strong. It reveals blindspots: I picked up the severity of the 2nd line clamp after losing a couple groups in high handicap games to it.

It's polite to play promptly, but try guessing your teachers moves. When they differ drastically from your expectation, try to understand why. In later games, ask yourself if the teachers you've played with would play a move you're considering.

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 Post subject: Re: How best to approach teaching game as a student?
Post #7 Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2014 9:42 am 
Honinbo

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Boidhre wrote:
it can take many, many ranks before something as "simple" as knowing when to invade at 3,3 becomes something firmer in your mind.


I once kibitzed a game between Takagawa and Yamabe. At one point in the opening Yamabe appeared to go into agony. He grabbed his head, moaned, rocked back and forth, shook his head, muttered, "Maitta" (= I've lost), sighed, and so forth. Finally he picked up a stone and invaded on the 3-3. ;)

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At some point, doesn't thinking have to go on?
— Winona Adkins

Visualize whirled peas.

Everything with love. Stay safe.

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 Post subject: Re: How best to approach teaching game as a student?
Post #8 Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2014 9:48 am 
Honinbo

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1) Take control of the game.
2) Take control of the game again.
3) Take control of the game again.

You have the advantage. Make the game as difficult as you can for White. :)

_________________
The Adkins Principle:
At some point, doesn't thinking have to go on?
— Winona Adkins

Visualize whirled peas.

Everything with love. Stay safe.


This post by Bill Spight was liked by: Bonobo
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 Post subject: Re: How best to approach teaching game as a student?
Post #9 Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2014 11:37 am 
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Thank you everyone! Your replies have been most helpful. What I'm most glad is that it doesn't look like I'm not doing anything wrong per say, but I will certainly take all of your opinion into consideration when having my next game.

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**We're living in a world that's make believe, they made; we believed.**
Please note: My KGS handle is different from my L19 username.

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