True.
But I don't find it more irritating than when the mail loses your package or standing in line at DMV for 4 hours, and stuff like that. Lets face it - this is a complex world, and whatever we do, every now and then we bump into good reasons to get irritated. Internet is no exception.

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- Bantari
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I am.

And from a newbie perspective the unlimited 'likes' feature in this forum seems to have generated a high school clique like culture ?

Basically,

1. 'like' people who 'like' your posts.

2. 'like' people who post against people who you dislike.

3. 'like' the all the posts of the people in the your clique.

Its a war of 'likes' out here !

Anyone feels the same about this?

Nope.
Personally, I 'like' the posts I like, regardless who posts them. I hope this feeling is reciprocated.

However - I do wonder about the reason for the 'like' button. Maybe its to cut on 'me too' posts? What does many 'likes' give you?

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- Bantari
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No?

I see likes as having a few features:

- Easy way to find posts I want to bookmark, in a way
- Way of giving credit to helpful people that's vaguely tangible
- Encourages posts that people like to read, whether because of humour or knowledge

I've never noticed any cliquishness about them, and don't like particular people or against particular people. In my experience, the people who gather the most likes are the ones who contribute to the forum frequently and who often contribute helpfully or interestingly. I suppose you could call more frequent posters a clique, but it seems odd to expect that less frequent posters would generate more likes.

I've seen similar features on other sites being used aggressively by people to belittle others. As in sarcastically liking someone's posts after making it very clear to them that you think they're an idiot. Or liking posts breaking the rules that abuse another user and similar. You also get, well, like wars where you have trench warfare between two groups and heavy liking going on of posts making petty point scoring attempts at the "enemy," 99% of the time though they're just used to show you found a post useful, insightful, funny or the poster said what you were going to say. Just like on here.

I’ve never wondered about these, or about “thank you” or “Karma” buttons. What I do wonder about is why some people in other forums seem to fish for likes/karma/thankyou and brag about high numbers (having lived on this planet for over half a century, I actually don’t wonder), but I have never observed such behaviour here (I think I’ve been here for about 2.5 years now which, to me, seems a long enough time to have an opinion).

Possible, but perhaps those programmers also think a little bit like me

I’m actually more interested in liking than in being liked

I click “like” when I like what I read, which may be for different reasons,the raisins being … helpful (i.e. I learnt something, or I think it is helpful for others), funny, friendly, thought-/mindful, caring, informative, etc. Cleverness alone usually is not enough for me to click. I click “like” to express my appreciation towards somebody for investing their time in meaningful communication.

I won’t deny, though, that it usually makes me happy if somebody liked what I wrote (although sometimes I wonder what exactly they liked), but I write what I write because *I* like it, and not in order to be liked by others.

I usually *do* hope that others like it, but this does not mean that I wish they clicked any button, but I rather wish it would be … helpful, informative, funny, etc. (see list above what I like). Seeing that somebody actually clicked the button is just a small sign that somebody liked it, which is nice to know, especially if the thread contains no direct feedback to the post/comment the person liked.

The impression of “cliques” that you, Duckweed, write about, is probably just related to what somebody wrote previously about internet & politics, and I guess it can be expected that people with similar mindsets “like” each other’s stuff more often than that of people with other views, but this is certainly not exclusive. Actually, it makes me happy when I can click “like” for somebody’s writing whose texts I usually don’t like that much. I guess I like crossing bridges/canyons

In the same direction, I think, goes the following observation of my own reading behaviour: Sometimes I notice that some people have many “likes”, but that I often either don’t understand or dissent with what’s been written. In such cases the “likes” give me reason to reconsider, and to watch more closely, because … maybe I really didn’t understand, maybe I can attain a new perspective … and also similar thoughts/feelings when somebody whose stuff I usually don’t really appreciate “likes” some of mine, this also often leads me to reading theirs with more patience to think about what they have meant.

Greetings, Tom

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“The only difference between me and a madman is that I’m not mad.” — Salvador Dali ★ Play a slooooow correspondence game with me on OGS?

Hello,

I may agree with a person during this discussion and like their comments. I may disagree with the same person in another discussion and not like their comments (even though I'd probably like them if I change my mind later). I won't like based on the person -- it's based on whether I agree with their points on the subject at hand.

Regards,
Doug

[admin]
I may like if they stick to the subject of the thread.
[/admin]

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Help make L19 more organized. Make an index: https://lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=5207

Don't worry Joaz. They're just preparing for the discussion regarding the future of "likes" in KGS' browser client.

Speaking of which -- Facebook Scam -- What Really Happens When You "Like"

Duckweed, my post was probably too ambiguous for its own good. I don't think you wrote anything unreasonable, but my perception is that KGS admins are not likely to work with you, so much as tell you that there is no lag, or rather that whatever lag you experience is probably on your end. My comment was intended to say that you had a charming faith in the system.

I guess they're probably right about the lag, btw, I just don't know how we'd really know that At least with the earlier suggestion, that the client itself is laggy, someone can monitor their own machine to see when packets are being sent, and if there were some client side-lag, I'm confident that it would have been seen by now. So my uninformed assumption is that the client is not producing any slowness. But as far as any slowness on the server-side, it's just "trust us!", things are ok.

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Occupy Babel!

One other thing to consider is that java itself can be fairly slow if there's a lot of other stuff running on the computer and/or it's an older machine.

The most important part of filing a bug report is that you give the set of conditions that reproduces the bug.

If your bug is not reproducible by the developer it will probably never get fixed.

If your bug report just consist of "It lags", I really can't blame the admins for being unable to assist you. Its just not good enough.

There are many sites that describes how to file a good bug report.

If a server has intermittently slow response times, you can't file a bug report against that. We're dealing with that problem here on L19--no one can write a real reproducible bug report because there's not much of a pattern--certainly no pattern a user can trigger. The only response is to carefully measure the server's performance and response time, and crunch the stats. That can be easy or hard, depending on your setup (heroku's queueing problem).

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Occupy Babel!

This only works if the bug is triggered by a set of conditions that I have any control over. If, from my perspective, it changes like the wind, that's all I can report. (I confess I'm rather doubtful that my report will ever make it to the developer anyway, and I know he's received similar reports in the past. And if the new HTML client appears and runs smoothly, it might never matter anyway.)

If the problem is caused by a buggy code segment, there will always be a pattern.

As not everybody connected to the server is encountering the lag, it is connection specific.

What you are doing at that time with the client would be would be what triggers the buggy code segment.

Hello,

A couple of weeks ago, we had a problem raised with connectivity issues via the admin mailbox. After some exchanges of e-mails, the player realised that he'd upgraded Kapersky (sp?) anti-virus. When he removed the anti-virus program, the connectivity issues ceased. I don't understand precisely why the anti-virus repeatedly interrupted the connection, but it caused the problem in this instance.

Given the complexity associated with real-tim connectivity over the internet, sometimes it's more surprising that everything works.

Regards,
Doug

Wow, I've only read the last couple of pages of this thread, so forgive me if I missed something pertinent, but this is a free server that everyone is complaining about. I could understand the incessant moaning if people were paying top dollar to be there, but they aren't. They are paying absolutely nothing in most cases, and a paltry fee in some other cases. I've been a paid up member, but didn't derive enough value, in that I was never around when the lectures were on, and watching replays that I couldn't participate in didn't do it for me. My fault, not KGS's.

As it stands, KGS is a wonderful place, I can't quite believe it's free. I play on IGS and Tygem, and KGS does seem to have a small lag, but nothing I would complain about. I think people need to take a step back and see what they are getting, not what they are not getting.

I think if WMS shares your view, he would still be playing on IGS and there would be no KGS.

Not necessarily.
There is a difference between wanting to create something good, or something even better (like KGS, Kaya, etc) and incessant whining. Things like holding a grudge for 10 years because of some email, or bashing a server because of a little lag which might not even be the clients issue, or the other stuff which is going on here.

I think what bleep is seeing is that there is a lot of simply bad attitude and malice towards KGS from the direction of a few individuals. They think they have all the good reasons for the way they feel, and maybe they do, but these reasons as given on this forum do not sound very convincing to some. Thus we have a discussion which has run its course long time ago and should have been dropped.

And now I am adding to it even more.
Oh boy...

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- Bantari
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