Life In 19x19
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Problems attacking.
http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=6694		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Alguien [ Sat Sep 08, 2012 9:47 am ]
Post subject:  Problems attacking.
In this game I had a good setup and even managed to "kill" a group and leave another very weak. However, while trying to kill the second, I also managed to die, saving all my opponent's stones.
Author:  skydyr [ Sat Sep 08, 2012 11:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Problems attacking.
I'm no stronger than you, so you may want to take this with a grain of salt, but I think the problem is that you are trying to kill the white group. If you play to force white to run on dame while you 1) make territory on the left and 2) lean with the top black group against the running white group, you can let white get out and end up with a good result. There's cash on the left, and strength for a strong attack against the top white group on the right.

Some other notes:
At move 45, if you want to keep white confined to the corner, try c15 so that white can't make sabaki to get shape and run. White will be able to get a tripod group in the corner, but the side will stay weak.

At 53, taking the base while white has a way out is consistent with letting white live and attacking the group to make profit while it runs. I'm not sure it's the best idea, but if you want to try to kill, you need to confine white first. You can also confine white with the intention of letting white live small, and attacking the surrounding white groups later with your new strength.

Regarding leaning, I think if you lean on the running white group with the left black group, an invasion around g3 or so becomes a real worry for white.

At move 69, I think just e16 or f16 to make territory while white doesn't get much is fine. Letting white split black is a terrible terrible thing and ruins the chance to attack the top white group.

At 99, I think the black top-right corner is too weak to attack with, and the black top center group is also floating a bit. Consider if black takes the bottom left corner with B3. White now has to worry about that long string getting cut off on the bottom and can't defend the rest of the corner.

If black presses on the top white group, I think black needs to make sure that moves on one side don't damage the group on the other side, and black should be playing forcing moves to ensure that his own groups become strong, not to weaken white. One goal could be to strengthen both groups and then attack the white group on the right side, which is not particularly strong right now either.
Author:  gasana [ Sat Sep 08, 2012 3:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Problems attacking.
At 44: if you want the side, i think you play nobi to the side (i.e c15) the hane give your opponent many forcing moves to hellp him... on the side
Author:  Magicwand [ Sat Sep 08, 2012 4:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Problems attacking.
you are very strong for 5k.
your reading is full of attack and kill ^^
you should learn how to win without killing then you will reach dan very soon.
every attack comes with risks so if you can avoid unreliable attack and win by points then you will have better winning percentage.
if your board position is even in the middleof the game...that means that your opponent is not that strong.. which means you will have another chance to kill him later so maintain balance and play thick. chances are you will win before the game is over.

very strong 5k.

edit:
did you think about (white 113) play other way?
if you atari and createD ko...you will likely capture one of two group.
Author:  OtakuViking [ Sun Sep 09, 2012 2:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Problems attacking.
Hi there! I hope this little thing helps you with the corner problem you had in the game.

And I agree with Magicwand. You look like you have a bright future ahead of you :)



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Author:  Alguien [ Mon Sep 10, 2012 12:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Problems attacking.
gasana wrote:
At 44: if you want the side, i think you play nobi to the side (i.e c15) the hane give your opponent many forcing moves to hellp him... on the side


I see that now. Thank you.


Magicwand wrote:
you are very strong for 5k.
your reading is full of attack and kill ^^
you should learn how to win without killing then you will reach dan very soon.


Thank you. I'll try to advance towards the "only threat to kill".

Magicwand wrote:
every attack comes with risks so if you can avoid unreliable attack and win by points then you will have better winning percentage.

if your board position is even in the middleof the game...that means that your opponent is not that strong.. which means you will have another chance to kill him later so maintain balance and play thick. chances are you will win before the game is over.


My yose sucks, though. I need to reach it being ahead about ten points if I want to have a chance.


Magicwand wrote:
edit:
did you think about (white 113) play other way?
if you atari and createD ko...you will likely capture one of two group.


At that point my thinking was "Left is dead. I must not let it revive while I attack the top.".

I think it should have been "Left is almost dead. I could use this attack to the top to kill it completely and maybe get a little more influence towards the right."

It's so hard to let groups live... I will have to put a post-it in the screen that says "the objective is to win the game, not to kill stones" and repeat it like a mantra as I play.
Author:  Alguien [ Mon Sep 10, 2012 12:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Problems attacking.
OtakuViking wrote:
Hi there! I hope this little thing helps you with the corner problem you had in the game.


Thank you. That was perfect.
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