Hello admins,

I think it’s time to …

1. Lock this sub-forum; kaya.gs has been dead for so long now …
2. Create a new sub-forum for OGS-related posts.

Thanks in advance

Tom

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“The only difference between me and a madman is that I’m not mad.” — Salvador Dali ★ Play a slooooow correspondence game with me on OGS?

What is it with you OGS fan boys that you hate the memory of kaya so much? This sub-forum has been dead for two years until your post. Why do you see the creation of an OGS sub-forum as somehow linked to locking this one? Get over it and get on with your life.

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Dave Sigaty
"Short-lived are both the praiser and the praised, and rememberer and the remembered..."
- Marcus Aurelius; Meditations, VIII 21

That's a bit much, Dave.

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Occupy Babel!

Dave, FYI: I was a great fan of kaya while it existed, even a paying supporter.

Thanks, very friendly, I wish you also a good life ♥

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“The only difference between me and a madman is that I’m not mad.” — Salvador Dali ★ Play a slooooow correspondence game with me on OGS?

Well I found the juxtaposition of ideas baffling the last time Tom made the same proposal and I still do.

Was I rude? Yes I was. I apologize. (Always be ready to activate your 'ez' filter on Saturday night - I've inevitably been out drinking with my Go buddies!)

PS: I was also a paying supporter of kaya. The 'get over it' part of my previous post actually was meant as advice (badly phrased!). I hadn't given it a thought in years until yesterday.

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Dave Sigaty
"Short-lived are both the praiser and the praised, and rememberer and the remembered..."
- Marcus Aurelius; Meditations, VIII 21

I thought everyone posted on L19 when they were drunk.

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be immersed

I'll second Bonobo's proposal. Given the success of the new OGS in terms of its website-based implementation, its substantial user base, and continuing development of its features, it would be nice if we had a place here to talk about it.

Why isn't there an OGS sub-forum here yet? Is it because they have their own forums, and there is no perceived need? Perhaps it does have something to do with dead kaya - admins not wanting L19 to sprawl out too much, and not wanting to repeat the mistake of reacting to the hype...

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Patience, grasshopper.

To give a serious response to this thread, IIRC, the choice of subforums was somewhat adhoc, partially based on what GoDiscussions.com used, with a few additions. I personally don't use the subforums much, with the exception of trying to select an appropriate one when creating a new thread. Most of my browsing is done via the "View new posts" feature.

I'm not opposed to an OGS forum, or the presence (or removal) of a Kaya.gs forum. Subforums are easy for admins to add and remove, so if there's enough demand, I don't see a problem with accommodating to this organizational request.

Maybe someone should make a poll?

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be immersed

... and this was liked by Bonobo. Yet no poll is happening.

C'mon, someone has to bite the bullet. Was this thread made with serious intent, or just fuel for another flamewar?

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My accounts:
OGS · KGS · DGS · Little Golem

Well, I find it baffling that juxtaposing a long deceased Go server with one that’s alive and kickin’, one that’s continually (if slowly) growing, can be so baffling to some


You more than made up or that by making my LOL Out Loud (did you know that LOL stands for “LOL Out Loud”?) … Anyway, I can relate to that. And I can tolerate a lot more “rudeness” from people I can relate to, so … all is well.

I just wish we lived closer to each other, then we could get drunk together and (carefully) test out our respective rudeness tolerance IRL


Peace, Tom



<edit>
And this:
<sigh> I’m just too busy currently, too tired to do it right now. And no, I have no interest in a flame war. Life’s hard enough
</edit>

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“The only difference between me and a madman is that I’m not mad.” — Salvador Dali ★ Play a slooooow correspondence game with me on OGS?

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My accounts:
OGS · KGS · DGS · Little Golem

All flames aside, I second the motion of closing the Kaya forum. Although I also question the necessity of it. Is there a downside in having the forum open? Nobody posts there anyways, so why anybody cares if it is formally closed or not. Its dead.

About OGS sub-forum - is there a need? Do OGS people want to post here in general? I have seen some OGS-related posts, but not that many...

Come to think of it, it might be an idea to simply consolidate all the server-forums into 'Go Servers' sub-forum. As far as I cam concerned, it would really simplify things. I, like most others, access messages via the 'view unread/new posts' link. And it would save me time when i create new threads so I won't have to figure out which forum to post in.

The only reason I can see for so many dedicated sub-forums is if people really use this feature to access posts from specific sub-forum only. It might be they do, so we should have all the sub-forums, and create a new one for OGS. Or maybe
they don't and we can consolidate for simplicity.

What I think would also me a new feature is to enable/disable sub-forums in the 'View unread posts' list, So if you are not interested, for example, in Malkovich posts - you never have to see them.

PS>
We could introduce some metric, for example: if a topic hits 100 threads/posts a year, it gets a sub-forum. If it does not, it does not. The sub-forum can get merged into some general topic if the traffic drops down. Do it on request-basis (so if somebody requests a sub-forum, check the messages and decide) and it might work. With some filters for potential abuse, of course.

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- Bantari
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WARNING: This post might contain Opinions!!

PMS much?

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- Bantari
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WARNING: This post might contain Opinions!!

(Emphasis added)

I like this idea. Might really be the best and easiest (as in “most logical") thing to do.

Anyway, it definitely seems odd to me that people post KGS-related posts to the KGS subforum, IGS-related posts to the IGS forum, Tygem-related posts … (you get it) but OGS-related posts turn up anywhere else. For me it’s not about “ranking OGS up”, it’s just the inconsistency that irks me. Keeping a sub-forum for a long dead server open while there is none for this “new” and increasingly popular server that people apparently want to talk about about is indeed odd, isn't it?

Most OGS-related stuff I’d actually prefer seeing discussed over there in the OGS forum b/c that’s where the probability is higher that the staff will read it, but there will always be people who’d rather want to talk about it elsewhere.

Disclaimer: I am, as you may know, “affiliated” (sort of, in that I am one of moderators there, albeit probably the least active one), but please note that I’ve been enthusiastic about nova.gs almost from it’s beginning (“early adopter”), and just as enthused later about the new (merged) OGS, long before I joined the team.


Oh, please don’t do that It’s not necessary, and it’s not helpful.

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“The only difference between me and a madman is that I’m not mad.” — Salvador Dali ★ Play a slooooow correspondence game with me on OGS?

Right. Knee-jerk... habit... hair-trigger... i have no excuse.
My apologies.

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- Bantari
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WARNING: This post might contain Opinions!!

I am not really an OGS user, so my opinion probably does not count as much as yours, but still - I disagree. I think we should try to consolidate english-language discussion rather then splinter it. I honestly wish there was no OGS forum and all the discussion would take place here instead of there. Would also be a much stronger argument for creating an OGS sub-forum on L19.

I get your point about bigger chance of devs and admins reading the OGS forum, but... I see no reason the devs and admins cannot as easily follow a sub-forum here as they do the OGS forum. Or does the OGS forum offer important features that L19 does not have? In any case - having a separate OGS forum is a choice, not a necessity. And a bad and harmful choice, I think.

As for concrete and practical reasons for the above, there are many. It would lessen the need for site-jumping for lazy people like me. As it is, I look at L19, reddit, rgg, and some more stuff, just for Go talk. I would much rather it was all neatly in one place, and I really dislike aggregators.

Another reason might be advertising. Posting about OGS in OGS forum does not give much exposure - its like preaching to the choir. Having threads about it where non-OGS people can easily read is would be nice. Just imagine how much good it would look for the OGS if people could (more) easily see threads like asking devs/admins for help and seeing this help being offered in timely and polite fashion! I bet this would be a drawing point. Especially compared to the IGS/KGS response (or lack thereof.)

And personally - pretty much the only time I go to OGS these days is when I read something interesting about it here and go there to check it out. Or to check out some new feature or something. Would probably never go there at all if not for the occasional post on L19. There are possibly others like me. And every time somebody goes there who does not usually go there - its an opportunity for a new customer. Why waste it?

etc.

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- Bantari
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WARNING: This post might contain Opinions!!

You guys make excellent points. OGS has been the fastest-growing English-language server for a while now, it makes no sense to keep Kaya.gs's forum around for years after its demise, but to ignore the biggest new player. I agree that the existence of an active forum on OGS itself shouldn't really matter - they're mostly focused on very narrow tech-support type stuff, and it's a separate community we have going here anyway.

So, it's up now! I've created the OGS subforum, and I'll remove the Kaya.gs one once everyone has had a chance to read this thread. (The threads themselves will still be available in the morgue, don't worry!). I'll move some of the recent threads from other boards that obviously would have been posted on the OGS subforum if one had existed at the time.

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The road to wisdom? Well, it's plain, and simple to express: Err, and err, and err again; but less, and less, and less!

I don't think non-admin users can see the morgue, can they?

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Occupy Babel!