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which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=7837 |
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Author: | marvin [ Fri Feb 08, 2013 12:12 pm ] |
Post subject: | which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
Which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? Mine: Newton–Leibniz http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fundamenta ... f_calculus Idea of linkind definite and indefinite integral or (Lagrange's) Mean Value Theorem: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... heorem.svg http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Calculus/S ... t_Theorems We use it all the time:P |
Author: | Solomon [ Fri Feb 08, 2013 12:26 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
Favorite theorem: P(A|B) = P(B|A)P(A)/P(B) |
Author: | speedchase [ Fri Feb 08, 2013 1:56 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
I don't know if it is technically a theorem, but I love l'hopitals rule. if lim x-> a (f(x)) is zero or infinity, and if lim x->a (g(x)) is zero or infinity lim x->a (f(x)/g(x)) = lim x ->a (f'(x)/g'(x)) edit: Just to be clear, there are some other conditions, but what I wrote above is the jist of it http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lhopitals_rule |
Author: | TheBigH [ Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:07 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
I've always like Euclid's proof of the infinitude of primes, and Cantor's diagonal argument that there are more real numbers than there are integers. But my favourite would have to be: Code: πix
e = cos(x) + i sin(x) |
Author: | EdLee [ Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:39 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
In college, we encountered this particular wording by our professor and it has remained my classmates' and my all-time favorite: Picard's theorem -- In any neighborhood of an essential singularity, a function takes on every possible value, except perhaps one, an infinite number of times. (my emphasis in red) |
Author: | GoRo [ Fri Feb 08, 2013 6:37 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
Ptolemy's theorem: Select any four points on a circle. Call one of them A, the next one B, and following this direction call the next one C and the last one D. Measure the sides of that quadrilateral a = AB b = BC c = CD d = DA and measure the two diagonals e = AC f = BD Magically it turns out that a*c + b*d = e*f Cheers, Rainer |
Author: | drmwc [ Sat Feb 09, 2013 11:53 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
I like this proof, beacuse it uses a nuclear weapon to crack a nut: Theorem 2^(1/n) is irrational for n>=3. Proof Suppose otherwise. Then there exists integers n (which is 3 or greater), p and q such that: (2^(1/n))^n=(p/q)^n Hence q^n+q^n=p^n. However, this contradicts Fermat's Last Theorem. QED A separate argument is needed for n=2 - Fermat's Last Theorem is not strong enough! (Unfortunately, the proof above actually turns out to be a circular argument if one follows the details through, and so it's not actually valid.) |
Author: | GoRo [ Sat Feb 09, 2013 12:42 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
drmwc wrote: (1)... I like this proof (2)... Fermat's Last Theorem is not strong enough! (3)... circular argument ... not actually valid. @(1): me too, thanks for sharing! @(2): that's a fancy way to put it, but "not actually valid" @(3): I can't detect a circulus vitiosus here. Let me repeat - slowly and for the sake of simplicity for n=3. Proposition: There are no natural numbers p and q such that (p/q)^3 = 2. Proof: Assuming the opposite we would have natural numbers p and q such that (p/q)^3 = 2. Then p^3 / q^3 = 2, i.e. p^3 = 2 * q^3 = q^3 + q^3. Let a = q, b = q, c = p. Then a^3 + b^3 = c^3 for some natural numbers a, b and c. That contradicts Fermat. Thus the assumption led to a contradiction. q.e.d. Cheers, Rainer |
Author: | Bill Spight [ Sat Feb 09, 2013 1:13 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
I like the proof that the base angles of an isosceles triangle are equal. The triangle is congruent to its own reflection. QED. ![]() |
Author: | drmwc [ Sat Feb 09, 2013 1:38 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
Rainer The circularity is non-trivial. Assume we use Wiles' proof of FLT - as far as I know, it's the only known proof. The proof shows equivalance of integer a^n+b^n=c^n with n>=3 to a "Frey curve" of the form y^2=x(x-a^n)(x+b^n). At this step of the proof, certain restrictions are placed on (a,b,c) such as them being pairwise coprime. Consider the equation we had p^n=q^n+q^n. The pairwise co-prime restiction applied to (p,q,q)is equivalent to a straightforward Euler proof that 2^(1/n) is irrational. |
Author: | GoRo [ Sat Feb 09, 2013 1:53 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
drmwc wrote: The circularity is non-trivial. Seems so ![]() But the circularity is not only non-trivial, but non-existent, too. Pardon me: I don't have to go into the details of the proof of any theorem I use for my proof. If the proposition, I am going to prove, is already a trivial subcase of the theorem, then so what? That is no problem and there is no circulus vitiosus. If you want to convince me of having used a circular argument you should point to a certain line in my proof and say: "Ha, here you are - that is something you use as if already proved!" For your convenience and easier pointing-out here are the lines of my proof, numbered: 1. Assume natural numbers p and q such that (p/q)^3 = 2. 2. Then p^3 / q^3 = 2, 3. i.e. p^3 = 2 * q^3 = q^3 + q^3. 4. Let a = q, b = q, c = p. 5. Then a^3 + b^3 = c^3 for some natural numbers a, b and c. 6. That contradicts Fermat. 7. Thus the assumption led to a contradiction. 8. q.e.d. The first error is in line ....? Cheers, Rainer |
Author: | Fedya [ Sat Feb 09, 2013 2:14 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
TheBigH wrote: I've always like Euclid's proof of the infinitude of primes, and Cantor's diagonal argument that there are more real numbers than there are integers. But my favourite would have to be: Code: πix e = cos(x) + i sin(x) http://xkcd.com/179/ |
Author: | jts [ Sat Feb 09, 2013 2:15 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
GoRo wrote: drmwc wrote: The circularity is non-trivial. Seems so ![]() But the circularity is not only non-trivial, but non-existent, too. Pardon me: I don't have to go into the details of the proof of any theorem I use for my proof. If the proposition, I am going to prove, is already a trivial subcase of the theorem, then so what? That is no problem and there is no circulus vitiosus. If you want to convince me of having used a circular argument you should point to a certain line in my proof and say: "Ha, here you are - that is something you use as if already proved!" For your convenience and easier pointing-out here are the lines of my proof, numbered: 1. Assume natural numbers p and q such that (p/q)^3 = 2. 2. Then p^3 / q^3 = 2, 3. i.e. p^3 = 2 * q^3 = q^3 + q^3. 4. Let a = q, b = q, c = p. 5. Then a^3 + b^3 = c^3 for some natural numbers a, b and c. 6. That contradicts Fermat. 7. Thus the assumption led to a contradiction. 8. q.e.d. The first error is in line ....? Cheers, Rainer 6. (Or are you being pedantic about the fact that no step in the proof assumes Fermat, so 6 -> 7 is non sequitur?) |
Author: | perceval [ Mon Feb 11, 2013 1:34 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
a similar thread on this forum: http://www.lifein19x19.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=4885h Cantors proof is also mentionned |
Author: | shapenaji [ Mon Feb 11, 2013 2:07 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
I always liked the integral of a gaussian over the reals. Integral(e^(-x^2)) from -Inf to Inf 1) Square the integral, 2) Then change from cartesian to polar, 3) Solve integral 4) Take the square root 5) Square again 7) Have dessert |
Author: | perceval [ Mon Feb 11, 2013 3:15 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
shapenaji wrote: I always liked the integral of a gaussian over the reals. Integral(e^(-x^2)) from -Inf to Inf 1) Square the integral, 2) Then change from cartesian to polar, 3) Solve integral 4) Take the square root 5) Square again 6) Multiply by 2 7) Have dessert love that one too |
Author: | GoRo [ Mon Feb 11, 2013 3:58 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
jts wrote: GoRo wrote: 1. Assume natural numbers p and q such that (p/q)^3 = 2. 2. Then p^3 / q^3 = 2, 3. i.e. p^3 = 2 * q^3 = q^3 + q^3. 4. Let a = q, b = q, c = p. 5. Then a^3 + b^3 = c^3 for some natural numbers a, b and c. 6. That contradicts Fermat. 7. Thus the assumption led to a contradiction. 8. q.e.d. The first error is in line ....? 6. (Or are you being pedantic about the fact that no step in the proof assumes Fermat, so 6 -> 7 is non sequitur?) Being pedantic is not so bad in mathematical context, no? "Fermat" is short for the (meanwhile proven) fact that there are no natural numbers a, b, c such that a^n + b^n = c^n for natural numbers n > 2. Thus step 5. proposes something which is impossible. That is, what my lines #6 and #7 are telling. I really cannot detect a circular reasoning. That would be the case if I wrote propositions p_1, p_2, p_3 etc. such that not all p_i could be proven from the p_j with j < i, but at least one of the p_i needed some p_j to be true, where j > i. I completely agree that the unsolvability of (p/q)^3 = 2 is such an easy thing to prove that it is part of "Fermat". But I doubt you can call that a circulus vitiosus. At least I see your point: you are trying to see "Fermat" not as a monolithic "fact", but you glance into the how-and-why of this proven truth. Greetings, Rainer |
Author: | Dusk Eagle [ Mon Feb 11, 2013 8:07 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
Mine would either have to be Cantor's diagonalization proof for uncountable sets, or Gödel's first incompleteness theorem. |
Author: | jts [ Mon Feb 11, 2013 10:34 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
GoRo wrote: But I doubt you can call that a circulus vitiosus. If you do not assume that Fermat's theorem is true, then our proof is false by non sequitur. If, on the other hand, you treat step 6 as an enthymeme which implies "... and we have a proof that Fermat's theorem is true," then our proof is false by petitio principii, since the proof of the theorem itself assumes our demonstrandum. |
Author: | GoRo [ Mon Feb 11, 2013 12:38 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: which is your favourite mathematical prof/teorem? |
jts wrote: If you do not assume that Fermat's theorem is true, then our proof is false by non sequitur. Fermat's theorem *is* true.Quote: ... an enthymeme ... false by petitio principii ... I see. I thought we were talking about mathematics, not rhetoric.In rhetoric you may be right, in mathematics you are not. Cheers, Rainer |
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