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How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=1637		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  RedStick [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 10:04 am ]
Post subject:  How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
I almost always use up more of my time than my opponent. And it often surprises me that people don't utilize the time given (if they want to play a quicker game why not choose appropriate time settings?).

I realize that some people may prefer to play quickly at the beginning to force the oppoenent into time pressure. But I greatly prefer taking my time, strategzing intensely in the first 60-80 moves or so, and reading out potential sequences around the board so that I can respond quickly when their time comes (and I'm normally in byo-yomi).

The only exception to this is when I know byo-yomi will be less than 20sec per move. (preferably i keep it at 30). In that case I will play quicker in the beginning in order to send my opponent into byo-yomi first.

I also would like to test a hypothesis that people who frequent L19x19 play slower than the average player. Since statistically people should fall 50/50.
Author:  Kirby [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 10:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
RedStick wrote:
...

I also would like to test a hypothesis that people who frequent L19x19 play slower than the average player. Since statistically people should fall 50/50.


I'm kind of curious if you came up with this hypothesis for some particular reason. Is it just a random guess?
Author:  kirkmc [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 10:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
It depends on the game. If it's a straightforward game with no tough reading, I may use less time, but if there's a lot of reading (such as an L&D problem), or if the game is close (I tend to count several times in a game), I may use more. So I'm not voting. :-)
Author:  RedStick [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 10:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
Kirby wrote:
RedStick wrote:
...

I also would like to test a hypothesis that people who frequent L19x19 play slower than the average player. Since statistically people should fall 50/50.


I'm kind of curious if you came up with this hypothesis for some particular reason. Is it just a random guess?


Yes. It's pretty much a guess. I probably should have phrased it: "It would be somewhat curious to find if the L19x19 community differs from the 50/50 split that we might assume exists." Although at Kirk points out, many people may not have a "normally".

Edit: I've edited the poll so that people in Kirk's position can vote.
Author:  kirkmc [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 10:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
RedStick wrote:

Edit: I've edited the poll so that people in Kirk's position can vote.


There you go - now I've voted. :-)
Author:  rubin427 [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 11:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
As per my vote, I typically play slower unless my opponent is significantly weaker than me. For example, six stones or more weaker.
Author:  Kirby [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 11:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
My AGA rank is weaker than my online rank. I can play around 1d KGS and 2d on tygem, but until the last tournament I went to, my AGA rank was around 3k (I think it's 2k, now).

As such, I am too arrogant when I play AGA games IRL. I might be playing against a 4k evenly, and I think, "Posh... I can't lose to him!", and I play very quickly. He threatens to kill my group, and I tenuki.

Sometimes this works, but sometimes I lose to "weaker (???)" players this way.

I really should slow down and think... I guess I have a short temper, as was pointed out elsewhere :(
Author:  Marcus [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 11:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
I'm in the minority. I play the game for fun, and trust my intuition to get me through rough spots. :D

I'm just impatient in general. It means that in a 30 minute +5x30 byo-yomi game on KGG, if it's not a tournament game, I might use 10 minutes total. I'm trying to slow down, but so far I've only succeeded in doing so for games against KGS 1d and above, which I usually lose anyways, but I learn a lot.

Hmmm ... I guess I just don't see the point of agonizing over my moves, trying to find something non-obvious. It's a game, right? ;)
Author:  Solomon [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 1:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
Depends on my opponent and how fast he plays.
Depends on the sort of game we're playing.
Depends on time settings.
Depends on my physical and emotional state.
Depends on the time and day.
Depends on the priority of other things I have to do in queue while I'm playing.
Author:  Loons [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 1:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
I`m normally slower, and I prefer it that way. Moves I make in haste (like "automatic moves") are often not so much moves as regrets. I think time is an important resource, that you should exploit as well as you are able.
Author:  LocoRon [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 1:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
99% of my games are played with a time setting of 30 minutes +5x30 byo-yomi.

If I'm playing an even game, I'll usually still have main time left over at the end of the game, and my pace will be roughly equal to my opponent, except for tough situations; I usually take my time on those.

If I'm playing a stronger opponent, I'll usually play slower and try to think and read deeper than normal. My clock might have noticeably less time than my opponent, even just a few moves in.

If I'm playing a weaker opponent, I'll tend to play a little on the fast side, and not read very deep... until I get slapped for being careless. Then I'll go into kill-em-all mode. :twisted:

Also, I think my in-person games tend to run longer than my online games.
Author:  Chew Terr [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 1:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
Maybe one game in ten ends with me in main time. In the rest, I'm in byo-yomi, often my last period. I'm bad at playing quickly, but I'm trying to get better, if only for those byo-yomi times.
Author:  Magicwand [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 2:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
i usually play fast..
but if it is a serious game i always enter buyomi before endgame.
i can spend 3 hours if i had that much time to think and it is serious enough for me to win.
Author:  phrax [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 2:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
It depends. If my opponent is even-strength or weaker, I typically play faster than them. If my opponent is stronger, I typically play slower (mostly because I'm watching for their tricks (which I probably can't see anyway)).
Author:  palapiku [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 2:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
Magicwand wrote:
i can spend 3 hours if i had that much time to think and it is serious enough for me to win.

Like against Kirby? :)
Author:  hailthorn011 [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 2:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
I used to play like every game was blitz, and people pointed that out as a major flaw in my game. Since then, I've been playing slower. Generally, if I'm playing online, I'll also play the sequences on an actual board. This has helped remedy my playing too fast, and helped make me a better player. So, I play slow. Normally I reach byo-yomi before my opponent has even spent 10 minutes of their time.
Author:  Shaddy [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 3:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
In ranked games and games against weaker players, I play very fast with less reading than I would in a tournament game, going mostly off instinct.. In a tournament game, I'll usually spend more time reading but often I'll play faster than my opponent anyway.
Author:  DrStraw [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 4:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
I play go for fun. I have better thing to utilize my time on. I mostly play on DGS and usually use less time that the opponent. On the rare time I play on KGS I usually set or accept very short time limits and almost always use less time than my opponent. There are way more important things in life than go.
Author:  dfan [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 5:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
I am more used to time management in chess than in go. In a tournament chess game, I am always very aware of the clock and generally try to stay ahead of my opponent. I have certainly won games largely because I managed my time better. This has carried over to some extent to my go games; I also try to stay ahead on the clock there.
Author:  CSamurai [ Mon Sep 13, 2010 6:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How quick do you play relative to your opponent?
RedStick wrote:
I almost always use up more of my time than my opponent. And it often surprises me that people don't utilize the time given (if they want to play a quicker game why not choose appropriate time settings?).


I play fast. Crazy fast. Silly fast. It leads to mistakes, and errors, and all around poor play.

I play fast when I choose slow time settings.

I play fast when I sit on my hands.

I even play fast when I am trying like hell to play slow and think about every move.

And I almost always choose slow time settings, because once in a great while, my opponent will play a move I didn't expect. And because just because I play fast about as well as I do slow (unfortunately true) doesn't mean I want to exclude slower players from playing against me. I like having the time. I often use 10 minutes or so of my own time, but a great deal of my time thinking is done on the opponent's clock, particularly if they make the move I expect.

I really should learn to slow down and think more.

Instead, I've focused on learning to play better fast (tsumego, tsumego, more tsumego.)

But then, I'm crazy.
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