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Are we humans or are we bots? http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=7564 |
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Author: | Solomon [ Thu Jan 03, 2013 4:06 pm ] |
Post subject: | Are we humans or are we bots? |
So I hear a lot of people claim that bots play "differently" than humans, that they have a different style and just play like bots. But I wonder if such people can tell, so a small exercise to them and those interested in participating: Below I've posted three games, non-blitz and all dan-level. The question is, can you tell how many of the players are bots and which ones are the bots? Games could be human vs. human, human vs. bot, or bot vs. bot. Should be easy right? |
Author: | billywoods [ Thu Jan 03, 2013 4:23 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
My guess is going to be: |
Author: | badukJr [ Thu Jan 03, 2013 4:25 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
I think when people talk about how 'bots' play differently, its that they have very specific flaws in their playing styles that can be exploited repeatedly until the author can update the code. This of course requires repeated playing that you won't see in this test. You won't be able to derive any conclusions here then. A better test is to show a 10 or 20 game series and ask which player is bot or human. |
Author: | Ellyster [ Thu Jan 03, 2013 5:03 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
I was going to say "All bots"... but in second thoughts: |
Author: | Joaz Banbeck [ Thu Jan 03, 2013 5:58 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
I only have two guesses about the six This is a great thread. |
Author: | snorri [ Thu Jan 03, 2013 6:30 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
I don't think it's that easy if you've actually included some bots here. |
Author: | gogameguru [ Thu Jan 03, 2013 8:31 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
Haha, interesting idea I think one factor that's still different is consistency (at whatever level). Even strong bots still seem to play a bit phrenetically. It's been awhile since I've watched bots play though, so let's see if I'm right... My guesses: |
Author: | hyperpape [ Thu Jan 03, 2013 9:33 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
Answers: Question: |
Author: | yoyoma [ Thu Jan 03, 2013 11:00 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
Author: | jts [ Fri Jan 04, 2013 12:25 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
Author: | tapir [ Fri Jan 04, 2013 6:19 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
I agree with gogameguru. |
Author: | Mike Novack [ Fri Jan 04, 2013 8:14 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
Please note. We were told "dan level" so that means MCTS based programs not more than a couple years old. Older experience with how bots play is not going to be relevant. Don't expect fixed patterns of play from the bots. MCTS doesn't work that way. Don't rule out moves because particularly "fashionable" or diabolically clever. Only those programs using a go knowledge AI to prepare a plausible move set going to be limited in this way. Straightforward MCTS can find any "best move". Do expect some "style" consistencies though these not might help much determining bot or human but then again might under certain circumstances. I haven't yet met a modern bot that played a "territorially tight" style so if you see that, guess human. |
Author: | hyperpape [ Fri Jan 04, 2013 10:14 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
Mike |
Author: | Bill Spight [ Fri Jan 04, 2013 11:44 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
Humans or bots? The two are not mutually contradictory. |
Author: | SmoothOper [ Fri Jan 04, 2013 11:47 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
Author: | v00d00 [ Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:56 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
My guesses: |
Author: | Unusedname [ Sat Jan 05, 2013 2:19 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
answers then again i'm only accustomed to playing against low level bots edit: cool my guesses weren't that far off of everyone elses. |
Author: | Solomon [ Mon Jan 14, 2013 1:30 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
Solutions: |
Author: | billywoods [ Fri Jan 25, 2013 8:57 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
Yay, 5/6 right! |
Author: | wineandgolover [ Mon Jan 28, 2013 9:38 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Are we humans or are we bots? |
Great post. Nice to see that the most popular poll answer was correct. I wonder if bots would have guessed so well? Stuff like this will help this board live up to its potential, and grow. |
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