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big endgame
http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=10172		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  SuprunP [ Fri Apr 18, 2014 6:22 am ]
Post subject:  big endgame
[...] White can slip into the corner with 1. Now the corner turns into White's territory. [...] White 1 here [is] big endgame.
(Learn to Play Go; Volume II)
Attachment:
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Would you be so kind as to tell me whether 1 in the following picture would be as big endgame as 1 in the previous example?
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Thanks.
Author:  Uberdude [ Fri Apr 18, 2014 6:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: big endgame
No, it's about 3 points smaller, though black will answer once and then tenuki:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ +----------------------
$$ | . . 7 5 6 . . . . . .
$$ | . 9 3 4 0 . . . . . .
$$ | . 1 8 X . . . . . X .
$$ | . . . , X . X . X , .
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . O X X . . . . .
$$ | . . . . O O X X . . .
$$ | . . . O . . O . . . .
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . .
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ +----------------------
$$ | . 7 8 . . . . . . . .
$$ | . 5 2 6 . . . . . . .
$$ | . 3 1 X . . . . . X .
$$ | . . 9 0 X . X . X , .
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . O X X . . . . .
$$ | . . . . O O X X . . .
$$ | . . . O . . O . . . .
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . .
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]


(7-8 here is a bit better for white hence "about"). The key point is white's sente follow up of the kosumi at 3 in the first diagram reduces black's upper side territory a lot. If you attach you can't do this.
Author:  Drew [ Sat Apr 19, 2014 9:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: big endgame
Please forgive my ignorance: where was B2 played in the first diagram from Uberdude?
Author:  Bill Spight [ Sat Apr 19, 2014 11:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: big endgame
There is an easy way to compare the plays.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W Attachment
$$ +----------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . 2 . . . . . . . .
$$ | . 3 1 X . . . . . X .
$$ | . . . , X . X . X , .
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . O X X . . . . .
$$ | . . . . O O X X . . .
$$ | . . . O . . O . . . .
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . .
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]


This is the normal result of the attachment.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W Slide???
$$ +----------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . 2 . . . . . . . .
$$ | . 1 3 X . . . . . X .
$$ | . . . , X . X . X , .
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . O X X . . . . .
$$ | . . . . O O X X . . .
$$ | . . . O . . O . . . .
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . .
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]


But if Black replied with :b2: to :w1: White would not continue with :w3:. OC, as Uberdude points out, Black does not have to reply to the slide. But the exchange, :b2: - :w3:, is clearly bad for White; so the original attachment is not as good as the slide. :)
Author:  Uberdude [ Sun Apr 20, 2014 1:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: big endgame
Drew wrote:
Please forgive my ignorance: where was B2 played in the first diagram from Uberdude?


Tenuki, as was :b4: in diagram 2. Both are gote yose plays. If black answers his move is smaller than white's initial move so white is happy to make points in sente.
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