Life In 19x19 :: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo

Does this program run well on Windows 7?

Thanks!

Has anybody tried these with WINE? I no longer own a native Windows installation, but I'd like to give them a go. And generally older software is better supported, but you never know...

What range of ranks would you say that this material is good for?

So I just got started with Contact Fights and it looks great so far. What does it mean to "lose a liberty in sente"?

If you are asking about definitions, perhaps this would be helpful http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Go/Lesson_ ... l_concepts

Aidoneus wrote:

If you are asking about definitions, perhaps this would be helpful http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Go/Lesson_ ... l_concepts

I've got the basic idea of sente and gote:

I have sente - I'm pushing someone else around
I am in gote - I'm being pushed around.

But some of the statements I read don't make sense to me yet.

The section is "Counting with Connections" (page 20)

"When your string links to another string and your opponent can push on that link (...), then you will lose a liberty in sente."

It seems that I would be in gote when I lose that liberty. The examples certainly look like something I'd want to respond to.

You are not the one with sente in that example. The opponent threatens the cut (playing sente) you defend, while losing 1 liberty. Since it's again opp's turn, he has still sente and you lost a liberty.

Author:	Aidoneus [ Tue Jun 03, 2014 3:18 pm ]
Post subject:	Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
Seeing various mentions of sectors lines led me to some information about Bruce Wilcox and two of his instructional dvds, Sector Fights and Contact Fights, which I ordered today from Yellow Mountain Imports. Is there a sequence I should follow with these two discs, or can I jump back and forth? Any other advice with using these discs?

Author:	EdLee [ Wed Jun 04, 2014 12:09 am ]
Post subject:
Hi Aidoneus, I think they complement each other. I think it's OK to start with Contact Fights. Maybe it's OK to work on Sector Fights in parallel. But I think it's definitely OK to work on Contact Fights first. If Bruce is reading this, maybe he can give you some suggestions. (You can also probably contact him via email, or a private message on KGS.)

Author:	Monadology [ Wed Jun 04, 2014 9:49 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
Sector Fights was more intuitive to me and easier to learn, but Contact Fights is probably more valuable to begin with first.

Author:	Yertle [ Wed Jun 04, 2014 6:29 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
I don't remember how I went through it but I think either contact fights first of trading off between each level between the two is fine. I can't say enough about these programs, bang for buck the best go instruction for me by far. When I bought it nearly 10 years ago I had been playing go for about 5 months and was still 22kyu and completely baffled by the game. In short order after going through these I jumped to 10 kyu and a bit more slowly after that to 4kyu which considering I was in my 30's at the time with a toddler was pretty impressive progress. Of course YMMV.

Author:	EdLee [ Wed Jun 04, 2014 11:30 pm ]
Post subject:
Hi Yertle, congrats. I also had good experience with Contact Fights.

Life In 19x19 http://www.lifein19x19.com/

Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=10394	Page 1 of 3

Author:	saxmaam [ Thu Jun 05, 2014 5:58 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
Does this program run well on Windows 7? Thanks!

Author:	Aidoneus [ Thu Jun 05, 2014 7:40 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
saxmaam wrote: Does this program run well on Windows 7? Thanks! My discs just arrived! So far they work fine on my PC running Windows 7; these are old programs. If anyone is interested, I may add comments on my experience with the instruction after I have had time to work with the discs.

Author:	saxmaam [ Fri Jun 06, 2014 5:22 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
Definitely interested.

Author:	joellercoaster [ Fri Jun 06, 2014 2:47 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
Has anybody tried these with WINE? I no longer own a native Windows installation, but I'd like to give them a go. And generally older software is better supported, but you never know...

Author:	Bonobo [ Fri Jun 06, 2014 4:57 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
joellercoaster wrote: Has anybody tried these with WINE? I no longer own a native Windows installation, but I'd like to give them a go. And generally older software is better supported, but you never know... I’ve tried them with CrossOver (a commercial WINE incarnation on for OS X and Linux, regularly 48€ but I got it cheap in some bundle) and there they seemed to run fine. Now, if only I could acclimatize myself with its seemingly 40+ year old user interface (yes, that’s slightly exaggerated) and its navigation which I perceive as extremely clumsy <edit> Oh, and if you have some olden Windows installation disc(s) you could also use the free VirtualBox virtualization environment (runs on Windows, Linux, Macintosh, and Solaris) which I’ve seen run very well in OS X. </edit> <edit 2> And now I see that Bruce Wilcox even says it on his Web site that it runs on WINE: Bruce Wilcox wrote: (Windows/WINE only) </edit 2> Cordially, Tom

Author:	fireproof [ Fri Jun 06, 2014 9:21 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
joellercoaster wrote: Has anybody tried these with WINE? I no longer own a native Windows installation, but I'd like to give them a go. And generally older software is better supported, but you never know... I'm currently using it on OS X 10.9 via Wineskin (http://wineskin.urgesoftware.com/tiki-index.php), a sort of wrapper that turns Windows executables into Mac apps - except for the fact that it won't save your progress between launches, it's just great.

Author:	Aidoneus [ Mon Jun 09, 2014 6:40 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
Contact Fights review The program did not need any extensions installed and ran perfectly. In addition to running the program from the DVD, the whole folder (less than 2.5 MB) could be copied to a local drive and run without messing with any DRM restrictions. As others have observed, this program should run under practically any Windows machine and many other systems through emulators. Good—Each chapter concept is clearly presented with examples, followed by a few interactive examples. At the end of each chapter except the last, following a short review, there is a test that gives feedback on what types of mistakes are still being made, which is useful in focusing review. Finally, each chapter except the last has one or more commented games to try to guess the “right” move(s), based on preceding material, at selected points of the game. (The last chapter has commented games without test questions.) Pedagogically, the instruction seems perfect through the first three chapters. Bad—It can be a bit frustrating to see a good move but have your answer rejected because only certain responses are allowed—correct answers are limited to what has been covered so far in the disc. This became less of a problem as I progressed through Elementary, Novice, and Intermediate chapters. The absence of test questions in the Advanced (final) chapter was somewhat disappointing. Ugly—The interface looks like it was created in the era of 16-bit video systems. In particular, reading the text for extended periods was a bit of a strain. Unfortunately, I could not find a way to change the font. EDIT: If I had read the installation instructions, I would have discovered that the F1 and F2 keys enable different fonts to be selected. Problem solved (mostly). Bottom line—As for the value of the material, I recognize many of my (DDK) common mistakes. I've looked at more than a few games posted in our forum by SDKs, who seem to make many of the same mistakes, though perhaps not so frequently. I enthusiastically recommend this for DDKs; it seems useful for SDKs, too. As for any impact on my rank, that is yet to be determined...

Author:	Aidoneus [ Sat Jun 14, 2014 6:00 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
Sector Fights (and Contact Fights redux) review Installation, graphics, and instructional style are generally the same as Contact Fights. So far, I have gone through the first two chapters, Elementary and Novice, leaving two more chapters, Intermediate and Advanced, of Sector Fights to study. I definitely find this disc to be more advanced than Contact Fights—in part this is probably because the emphasis in Sector Fights is often on global or multipurpose moves. The main benefit I got from Contact Fights was a simple rule for determining stability, and thus when each side may safely tenuki. Of course, no rule should be followed blindly but knowing the usual course pushes one to consciously justify deviations based on particular circumstances. In addition, I now have a much better grasp of where to play during contact fights for better future shape. (Maybe when I go through this disc again in a month or so I will find more nuanced lessons that I missed the first time.) So far, the main benefit I have absorbed from Sector Fights concerns building links and not just placing stones wildly about to create sector lines. The lessons on direction of play and making multipurpose moves that work with all (or at least many) of your existing stones was especially helpful, though I still have trouble applying this lesson. I also now finally understand the rule for extensions from walls in terms of edge height for containing/killing invasions. I don't want to infringe on copyright material, so I will just say that the author's large number of rules (developed, as I understand, for his computer go program) are just what this beginner needs till he can begin to rely on his own experience. Bottom Line--this disc is a bargain at twice the price for a DDK like me! Finally, for what little its worth, Many Faces of Go set at 1 dan and 0 handicap just demolishes me—so much so that I usually just quit after about 50 moves. Today, I decided to set MFG at 15k, 0 handicap, 6.5 komi and won by 30.5 points. (I have heard that crippling computer go programs is a bad idea, though.) Bruce Wilcox strongly urges one to stop after the first two chapters and play 20 games. I think that I will take his advice, get drubbed some more online against humans, and come back to this disc in a week or so. Oh how I wish I could find local players to use my stones, board, and clock with! You know, lose the game but win the post-mortem.

Author:	saxmaam [ Sun Jun 15, 2014 2:51 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
What range of ranks would you say that this material is good for?

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Author:	Aidoneus [ Sun Jun 15, 2014 5:08 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
saxmaam wrote: What range of ranks would you say that this material is good for? Well, I'm just a DDK but I think that Sector Fights is useful for SDKs, especially as I haven't even tackled the last half yet. Maybe some higher ranked players would give you their opinion, though. In any case, it probably depends on what "holes" someone has in their training/understanding. Myself, I learn faster by first seeing a theoretical framework and then filling it in with experience. I am sure there are others who can extrapolate knowledge quicker from direct experience.

Author:	saxmaam [ Mon Jun 16, 2014 1:20 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
So I just got started with Contact Fights and it looks great so far. What does it mean to "lose a liberty in sente"?

Author:	Aidoneus [ Mon Jun 16, 2014 1:57 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
saxmaam wrote: So I just got started with Contact Fights and it looks great so far. What does it mean to "lose a liberty in sente"? If you are asking about definitions, perhaps this would be helpful http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Go/Lesson_ ... l_concepts In general, a move that reduces the liberties of an opposing group is sente if the opponent must respond to the threat. (Sometimes the opponent can ignore the threat to make an even stronger threat of their own.) For more than this, I would need to know the exact context. If you are still unclear, or my response doesn't seem to apply, let me know exactly where to find the usage in Contact Fights.

Author:	saxmaam [ Mon Jun 16, 2014 2:13 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
Aidoneus wrote: If you are asking about definitions, perhaps this would be helpful http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Go/Lesson_ ... l_concepts I've got the basic idea of sente and gote: I have sente - I'm pushing someone else around I am in gote - I'm being pushed around. But some of the statements I read don't make sense to me yet. The section is "Counting with Connections" (page 20) "When your string links to another string and your opponent can push on that link (...), then you will lose a liberty in sente." It seems that I would be in gote when I lose that liberty. The examples certainly look like something I'd want to respond to.

Author:	RBerenguel [ Mon Jun 16, 2014 2:16 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
saxmaam wrote: Aidoneus wrote: If you are asking about definitions, perhaps this would be helpful http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Go/Lesson_ ... l_concepts I've got the basic idea of sente and gote: I have sente - I'm pushing someone else around I am in gote - I'm being pushed around. But some of the statements I read don't make sense to me yet. The section is "Counting with Connections" (page 20) "When your string links to another string and your opponent can push on that link (...), then you will lose a liberty in sente." It seems that I would be in gote when I lose that liberty. The examples certainly look like something I'd want to respond to. You are not the one with sente in that example. The opponent threatens the cut (playing sente) you defend, while losing 1 liberty. Since it's again opp's turn, he has still sente and you lost a liberty. In semeais or similar, liberty-tight situations both players have just gote plays to remove liberties from each other.

Author:	saxmaam [ Mon Jun 16, 2014 3:19 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Bruce Wilcox's Go Dojo
RBerenguel wrote: You are not the one with sente in that example. The opponent threatens the cut (playing sente) you defend, while losing 1 liberty. Since it's again opp's turn, he has still sente and you lost a liberty. So the text is just in error, then?