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| Rank and quality of play http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=3662 |
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| Author: | Tangerine [ Fri Apr 15, 2011 10:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Rank and quality of play |
I've been pretty confused lately about how strong "strong" players are. I'm a 2 or 3 kyu on KGS, and recently a 3 dan reviewed a game for me and I was amazed at how much complex strategy was fairly simple to him. However, sometimes I watch a high level game and the moves seem very poor to me. I don't know if they are actually correct and I just can't see it. Or maybe the players know better, but they just make those poor moves for fun. Or maybe in a blitz game (most high dan games on KGS seem to be blitz) it's too much for them to consider strategy like they would in a slower game. Here's a good example: Move 35 seems like the complete wrong direction (don't play near thickness, don't use thickness to make territory). Am I missing something here, or was it an honest mistake? I would think a 5 dan would never make such a mistake. (Side note: In the kibitz I ask about s2 as well, but I think I see now that it protects the cut.) Other times I see strong players choosing to live small in gote at the beginning of the game in order to deny their opponent a small amount of territory...while the opponent gets lots of useful outside thickness. I know hindsight is 20/20, but I think of myself as much weaker, so I feel I shouldn't see any mistakes in their play. I hope I haven't offended anyone. I am genuinely curious...especially because I know those players would destroy me if I played them. |
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| Author: | SoDesuNe [ Sat Apr 16, 2011 12:09 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rank and quality of play |
I think #35 is a good choice in terms of defending one weaknesses. If White would be able to extend towards Black's wall he could peep at various points and make the wall a tasteful dumbling. And since White is strong at the bottom he could then chase this dumbling enlarging his framework. With #35 Black forces White into an ineffecient shape while first defending his wall's weakness and second scetching out some territory at the top. post scriptum: As for living in Gote. I experienced that sometimes my opponents (kyus not dans) play endgame moves in the opening or early middlegame. But they are just too small to answer, so I take a big point. At several occaisions the follow-up of this endgame moves threatens now the life of a group, so I have to defend and end maybe in Gote but still I got the next big play on the board and thus could take some initiative. |
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| Author: | Tangerine [ Sat Apr 16, 2011 12:15 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rank and quality of play |
Hmm yea you could be right. I remember someone's recent quote that the moves that look absurd come from either weaker or stronger players. |
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| Author: | Shaddy [ Sat Apr 16, 2011 9:15 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rank and quality of play |
Dan players aren't wizards. We make stupid mistakes like kyus, just less often. |
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| Author: | Mef [ Sat Apr 16, 2011 5:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rank and quality of play |
I think part of it might be that in a blitz game there isn't as much time spent finding the best variation vs. finding a variation that is "good enough". For instance with the 35-39 sequence, it's straightforward, easy to read, black gets a chance to cash in on the right and leave white with a shape that is perhaps a bit cramped. In a fast game, it may be simply that this was the first acceptable variation that was found with a low opportunity for time-consuming surprises. |
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| Author: | RobertJasiek [ Sun Apr 17, 2011 2:54 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rank and quality of play |
The game you show us contains a lot of terrible mistakes. 35 is one of them. Except for special strategies, R13 is the only move. A 5 dan, who uses reasoning instead of intuition, thinks about 100 times as many good variations, reasons etc. as a 3 kyu. As a consequence, the 5 dan can then reduce that amount of information to identify which is essential and explain that to you as if it were simple. He tells you only the best reasons, so you are convinced easily how simple the decision is. If you insist and press your reasoning-based teacher, then he can explain all the background, even its many bad parts:) Note though that many players rely on intuition and therefore might not be able to explain their decision-making in all detail. |
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