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 Post subject: Attatchment Tesuji
Post #1 Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2012 9:18 am 
Dies in gote

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Universal go server handle: Gegenzeit
Hi,

I'm currently studying tesuji with the help of Tesuji by James Davies. Sadly, from time to time I do not even get the explanations ;)

Here black is to play. The solution says black is to play the attatchment tesuji a, threatening the driving tesuji at b.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c tsumego //Tesuji p.173
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O X . a O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X X O . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . X X . . b . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I guess it would look like this (white tenukis). White would get pushed around.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c white tenukis
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O X . 1 O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X X O 4 5 . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . X X . . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


To avoid that white should play like here. Black comes out.


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c tsumego // solution p. 174
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O X . 1 O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X X O . 3 . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . X X . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Sadly, the book does not explain why these are the best moves. And frankly, I do not get it. If white plays 2, the driving trsuji does not work anymore.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c ?!?
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O X . 1 O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X X O 4 2 . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . X X . . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I also can't find another move for black to counter the hane. So, to my question (finally). How to punish white 2:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c ??????
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O X . 1 O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X X O . 2 . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


thanks!

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 Post subject: Re: Attatchment Tesuji
Post #2 Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2012 9:23 am 
Oza
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c ??????
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O O O O X . 1 O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X X X O 3 2 . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . X X . . 4 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This looks better for B than the driving tesuji... W has more blighted stones, no?

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 Post subject: Re: Attatchment Tesuji
Post #3 Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2012 1:49 am 
Dies in gote

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Universal go server handle: Gegenzeit
Hi & thanks. Sometimes one does not see the most simple things ;)

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Post #4 Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2012 4:06 am 
Honinbo
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For completeness, notice the broken shapes for W:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$ ---------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . O X . . . .
$$ | . O O O O X . # W .
$$ | . O X X X O W # . ,
$$ | . X X . . X . . . .
$$ | . . O X . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . .[/go]
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$ ---------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . O X . . . .
$$ | . O O O O # . # W .
$$ | . O X X X W # W . ,
$$ | . X X . . W # . . .
$$ | . . O X . . . . . .
$$ | . . . . . . . . . .[/go]

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