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 Post subject: Re: Amazon army
Post #201 Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2022 1:21 am 
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Okay, the match I've been super excited for, Fujisawa Female Meijin wins game 1 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zt8SJshZdZQ. Unless Sumire gets miraculously stronger by tomorrow it's looking tough for Sumire Sensei (and pretty easy for Fujisawa Sensei)

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Post #202 Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2022 2:09 am 
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Quote:
Unless Sumire gets miraculously stronger by tomorrow it's looking tough for Sumire Sensei (and pretty easy for Fujisawa Sensei)


Except for one rather odd thing. Sumire had Black. Of the 180 games of hers that I now have, she scored 41 out of 92 (45%) with Black. But with White her score is 55/88 (63%). That's a massive difference, and 180 games seems to be a decent sample size.

And.... In Rina's case, with Black her score is 107/210 (51%) and with White 114/190 (60%).

So the colours may be said to favour Sumire tomorrow. And if they do, colours in in Game 3 will depend on nigiri.

Why such a marked colour discrepancy? It doesn't apply to Ueno Asami, BTW. She is 56% with Black but 46% with White. Even that large gap (in over 200 games) is surely unexpectedly large.

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Post #203 Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2022 12:35 pm 
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Wow! They played the first 2 moves so much faster than the other Meijin tournament that I have no idea how the reporters kept up. There was a hidden bucket under the table where Sumire kept her signature blanket. But what about her signature mask?

And we got Yamashita Keigo and Seki Kotaro commenting on stream. It's always nice when they have two people. Seki showed his bento lunch -- nothing fancy.

I was interested by the initial fight on the upper side starting with the attachment on top of the pincer. It seemed like a rare play. Yamashita showed some variations on the upper side that looked better for Black. But Fujisawa seemed to take the upper-hand. I'm not sure what to think about that fight -- just that Fujisawa Rina is strong.

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I'm happy most tournaments don't have multiday games. I'm looking forward to the next. Maybe Sumire will be more confident with White.

----------

I just saw the notification that little Ueno's 1st round Honinbo game is going to be streamed live on the Nihon Kiin's channel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjpJYn40UOM

Is she popular? Or just because of her sister? I don't think it's because of her opponent Osuka Seira, also shodan, who I just learned of.

The commentator is listed as Ohashi Hirofum, who I know from his Nihon Kiin Overseas lecture on Dosaku's kake, Shusaku's anto-kake, and Go Seigen's preemptive kake. I was about to say that I remember he was schedule for a previous YouTube commentary but never showed up. Looking through old videos I see it was Judan Game 3 and he did show up -- I was just asleep.


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Post #204 Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 3:33 am 
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The female Meijin match ended yesterday.

The result was 2-0 for Fujisawa sensei. This was expected. But how things went... I am not sure if they were expected.

When the challenge was decided, and all the buzz started, I learnt that Rina and Sumire hadn't had an official game yet. Rina doesn't play in most of the female titles, as a title holder, and in the prelims (female and open tournament), she is mostly seeded higher than Sumire. So they still play in different levels. Unless some draw comes, they don't overlap. But this time, the World Senko Cup happened, and the draw paired them. Although it was an on-line game, they were in the same room and could see each other. The result, a 3.5 moku loss for Sumire. Close but not enough. Some people thought that the difference of strength was not so big, and with the right conditions and momentum...

I could see the first game of the match. I though that Sumire was aggressive, and Rina held well. In the end, Rina was ahead before yose, and being strong in yose, it was game over. For the second game, she was more aggressive, too much IMHO. I didn't know that Sumire wins more as white. Maybe she feels comfortable playing like this and komi favours her. Opinions are welcome. My feeling was that Sumire needs to realize when she is overly aggressive. Against players of Rina's level, and above, her shortcomings are more visible. That was a good learning chance for Sumire.

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Post #205 Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:40 am 
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pajaro wrote:
The female Meijin match ended yesterday.

The result was 2-0 for Fujisawa sensei. This was expected. But how things went... I am not sure if they were expected.

When the challenge was decided, and all the buzz started, I learnt that Rina and Sumire hadn't had an official game yet. Rina doesn't play in most of the female titles, as a title holder, and in the prelims (female and open tournament), she is mostly seeded higher than Sumire. So they still play in different levels. Unless some draw comes, they don't overlap. But this time, the World Senko Cup happened, and the draw paired them. Although it was an on-line game, they were in the same room and could see each other. The result, a 3.5 moku loss for Sumire. Close but not enough. Some people thought that the difference of strength was not so big, and with the right conditions and momentum...

I could see the first game of the match. I though that Sumire was aggressive, and Rina held well. In the end, Rina was ahead before yose, and being strong in yose, it was game over. For the second game, she was more aggressive, too much IMHO. I didn't know that Sumire wins more as white. Maybe she feels comfortable playing like this and komi favours her. Opinions are welcome. My feeling was that Sumire needs to realize when she is overly aggressive. Against players of Rina's level, and above, her shortcomings are more visible. That was a good learning chance for Sumire.


Perhaps playing the Fujisawa Female Meijin in a title match for the first time made her anxious and then revert to her old mistakes, out-Akira Touya-ing Akira Touya, interestingly.

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Post #206 Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 12:35 pm 
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I got a similar feeling watching the game and commentary -- Nakamura Sumire played good moves but Fujisawa Rina is strong and knew how to handle it and get the upper hand.

But look at Ichiriki losing to Iyama time after time and now he's Kisei. I'll be looking forward to Sumire's next few challenges against Rina.

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Post #207 Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 1:46 pm 
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I gather Sumire missed a chance to win in Game 1 and that was associated with a reference to the pressure she was under. 30 tv and newspaper outlets were present in the media scrum.

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Post #208 Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:41 am 
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After game 1, Sumire told that she played as usual.

I am not in her head, and I have never been in any situation like that. But I am older than her. Sometimes you are under pressure and don't even realize. You think that your mind is clear, working as it's supposed to do, but it doesn't. Some time later, you say "oh, I remember that time...".

That's called growing.

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Post #209 Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2022 11:37 pm 
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pajaro wrote:
After game 1, Sumire told that she played as usual.

I am not in her head, and I have never been in any situation like that. But I am older than her. Sometimes you are under pressure and don't even realize. You think that your mind is clear, working as it's supposed to do, but it doesn't. Some time later, you say "oh, I remember that time...".

That's called growing.


It seems more likely that if the discrepancy you perceive is true, it's just her downplaying it. Although pro opinion might not think that game is over aggressive!

If Cho Chikun is anything to go by you can be emotional and still win titles. Don't be surprised if next year she takes the title 2-0!

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Last edited by Elom0 on Tue Apr 19, 2022 1:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post #210 Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 12:39 am 
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Different players may have different skills, personalities... and win lots of titles, or never win one.

Next year, Sumire wins 2-0? Yes, why not. Who knows what will happen in the future. But there is something else: today's Sumire would beat the Sumire that started the league. And would lose to the Sumire that will play the first game of next year's league. This, I think is pretty sure.


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Post #211 Posted: Thu Apr 21, 2022 1:27 pm 
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Ueno Asami visited commentator Ohashi Hirufumi as he was finishing up commentary on Ueno Risa's win (Honinbo tournament). She signed some Senko Cup programs and they are being raffled off on Twitter. https://twitter.com/UgenNihonkiin/statu ... 4970982402

The Senko tournament qualifying rounds are close to completion. So the 16-player challenger league should start soon. Maybe it's too far out but I don't see any games scheduled on the Nihon Kiin's channel. Does anyone know where it's covered?

By the way, I realized that Ohashi is the one who wrote the book using AI on Shuwa and Shusaku's games.

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Post #212 Posted: Thu Apr 21, 2022 3:56 pm 
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I see that a couple of games still have to be played. Sumire vs. Hoshiai and Chiaki vs. Nyu. Both pairings have happened not too long ago.

But I see that last year, the prelims finished by the end of April (like this year), but the main tournament started in June and finished in September. So don't hold your breath.

Another news: today, in a game for the B prelim of the Judan, Nyu Eiko beat Hirata Tomoya 7-dan. Big win, I think, because he is one of the strong young players. She will play the A tournament. Suzuki Ayumi, on the other hand, lost to Lee Ishu 8-dan, also in the last game of the B prelim of the Judan.

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Post #213 Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2022 5:18 am 
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The Aidu Cup has started. Also known as Tachioi Cup.

In the first round, Kibe Natsuki 2-dan beats Kato Chie 2-dan; Ueno Asami 4-dan beats Takao Mari 1-dan; Suzuki Ayumi 7-dan beats Tatsumi Akane 3-dan and Okuda Aya 4-dan beats Nyu Eiko 4-dan. Factoid: the 2nd player, as written in the chart, always beats the 1st player. Next round will be May 21st, and last round, to decide the challenger, the next day. Title holder is Fujisawa Rina 5-dan.

More interesting, the female Honinbo has started. This is a knock-out tournament with 23 players. Weird number. Ueno Risa 1-dan has already beaten Osuka Seira 1-dan. It was on youtube. The usual names, and some more, are playing. And the usual title holder, Fujisawa Rina, is there too.

Let's see if it is as interesting as the Meijin.

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Post #214 Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2022 7:37 pm 
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pajaro wrote:
More interesting, the female Honinbo has started. This is a knock-out tournament with 23 players. Weird number. Ueno Risa 1-dan has already beaten Osuka Seira 1-dan. It was on youtube.

Do you have a link?

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Post #215 Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2022 8:32 pm 
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gazzawhite wrote:
pajaro wrote:
More interesting, the female Honinbo has started. This is a knock-out tournament with 23 players. Weird number. Ueno Risa 1-dan has already beaten Osuka Seira 1-dan. It was on youtube.

Do you have a link?

Here's a link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjpJYn40UOM

Something I've always wondered -- is the YouTube commentator just sitting in a room in the Nihon Kiin that everyone can see as they walk by? I swear so many people just show up to join the various commentators. In this game Fujisawa shows up and then later big sister Ueno shows up. Is this all planned or just coincidence?


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Post #216 Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2022 10:26 pm 
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CDavis7M wrote:
Something I've always wondered -- is the YouTube commentator just sitting in a room in the Nihon Kiin that everyone can see as they walk by? I swear so many people just show up to join the various commentators. In this game Fujisawa shows up and then later big sister Ueno shows up. Is this all planned or just coincidence?


I think so. That's one of the press rooms. Not very open, I guess, to avoid noise. But looks like it's open and anyone can go there, take a peek, or even be invited to talk. You can see that it isn't always planned because sometimes, their names take a long time to be on screen.

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Post #217 Posted: Wed May 04, 2022 1:06 am 
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I was wondering... besides the odd YouTube video or blog, is there any media on Japanese Amazons in Western languages? Books? I know some time ago I started checking for Kita Fumiko and similar players, and I could only find Kifu. Do we have any monographs on, say, Fujisawa Rina, Xie Yimin... I think back when, there was some info on Rui Naiwei, but... There's quite a void, isn't there?

In this vein, I've been checking for a couple of days on Fujisawa Rina, Xie Yimin, Hoshiai Shiho... and so on. I don't seem to be able to find any *specific* game that is somehow significant. I mean, all those games are quality games, professional... But I haven't been able to find one that is somehow above the others, in either quality of significance. Any ideas?

Thanks. Take care.

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Post #218 Posted: Wed May 04, 2022 1:59 am 
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Ferran wrote:
In this vein, I've been checking for a couple of days on Fujisawa Rina, Xie Yimin, Hoshiai Shiho... and so on. I don't seem to be able to find any *specific* game that is somehow significant. I mean, all those games are quality games, professional... But I haven't been able to find one that is somehow above the others, in either quality of significance. Any ideas?


For this, I think that important games happen in important events. So we have to wait until some of them make it to the big leagues, or in international events.

Fujisawa Rina will play soon to be top 4 in the Tengen. If she wins, in the future when people look for her significant games, this one will show up. Also, to qualify for the Judan, she beat Ichiriki.

It takes time to see what games are worth remembering.

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Post #219 Posted: Wed May 04, 2022 3:03 am 
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I was wondering... besides the odd YouTube video or blog, is there any media on Japanese Amazons in Western languages? Books? I know some time ago I started checking for Kita Fumiko and similar players, and I could only find Kifu.


I have written a long piece on women in go, going back to Han times in China and Yokozeki Iho in Japan, that you can still find in Go World (the English version), and I regularly include anecdotes about the likes of Hayashi Sano, Kita and Suzuki Hideko in my other books.

But books on female players in Japan are, if not like hen's teeth, rather rare, and rather different in tone. There was Kobayashi Reiko's autobiographical love story book, and the paean to Oyama Toshiko by her pupils. Perhaps the best book for a western audience would be the book on the then current up players (from Sugiuchi Kazuko down) issued by the Nihon Ki-in Female Pros Association to mark their 30th anniversary in 2004. This includes biographical sketches and highlight games of over 20 players, all bar Ito Tomoe still playing. The situation is similar in China, and there is even less in Korea.

In general, those seeking info on female go have to be truffle hunters rather than supermarket customers. Hard work but you get to enjoy it more.

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Post #220 Posted: Wed May 04, 2022 3:29 am 
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John Fairbairn wrote:
I have written a long piece on women in go, going back to Han times in China and Yokozeki Iho in Japan, that you can still find in Go World (the English version), and I regularly include anecdotes about the likes of Hayashi Sano, Kita and Suzuki Hideko in my other books.


Yep, I've read it.

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But books on female players in Japan are, if not like hen's teeth, rather rare, and rather different in tone.


I was afraid of that, yes.

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Perhaps the best book for a western audience would be the book on the then current up players (from Sugiuchi Kazuko down) issued by the Nihon Ki-in Female Pros Association to mark their 30th anniversary in 2004.


That would be cool, although I'm not sure how deep the entries would be.

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In general, those seeking info on female go have to be truffle hunters rather than supermarket customers. Hard work but you get to enjoy it more.


Indeed. What I was observing these days is that everyone seems to choose his (IME, mostly *his*) pet game, or maybe most accessible sgf or... to comment. But there doesn't seem to be something like "Well, this is the game that put X on the spotlight" or... Damn, I don't even think I've found comments on Rui Naiwei's Kuksu, or more than one or two about... Fujisawa Rina's Al Cup? I'm quoting from memoery, but I think that was it.

There are events that are kind of equivalent to, say, the 7th Kisei, or Shibano Toramaru's rise, and their players will get some screen time... but the games chosen are all over the place.

I'll have to think a bit. Take care. And thanks

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