Life In 19x19 :: Mysterious new vets tournament

Let's hope the oldies remember which day the games are on!

...

The biggest bafflement, Mystery 4, is the commercial goals of the sponsors. There are two. There is S T Corporation, which makes a wide range of household goods and Fumakilla which makes things like insecticides. What on earth is the association between go and fly spray and geriatrics? It's women in Japan who buy the hosuehold goods and pesticide cans, anyway...

Finally it is hard for my brain to comprehend that O Rissei who thrashed me at ping pong at the first go congress and seemed like such a kid - is now a veteran.

And, if I still wore my quizmaster hat, I would challenge you all to name which player would be next to join the field - he appears to have missed the cut by a matter of months...

The contestants are Cho Chikun (54), Ishida Yoshio (52), Rin (58), Otake (58), Kobayashi Koichi (58), O Rissei (52), Kobayasho Satoru (51), Takemiya (60), Kudo (70), Hane Yasumasa (66) and Kataoka (52).

Author:	John Fairbairn [ Sun Jan 30, 2011 5:14 am ]
Post subject:	Mysterious new vets tournament
There is a new tournament starting in Japan next month (Feb 2010), and it baffles me in several ways. Others may wish to speculate. First, it is for veterans, a first in Japan. China and Korea have veteran tournaments but these were introduced for a very specific reason. With the rise of the teenyboppers, many vets in C and K were wondering where the next bowl of rice was coming from. That's hardly been a problem in J, even with its bloated 9-dan population, but still one wonders whether this is a sign of things to come. Mystery 1. However, the new event, the Go Masters Cup, is clearly not intended as an alms house. It is limited to players of 50 and up who hold or have held one of the major seven titles. These are people who have already made it big, and sometimes even have a nice pension from their title-winning exploits. Why would other, more needy, players sanction such an exclusive event? Mystery 2. We can see what the sponsors might get out of this. Access to big names, and not too many players (11 in Term 1), so reducing the sponsorship bill mightily. But oldies only? Yesterday's men? Mystery 3, unless this is a touch of nostagia. The biggest bafflement, Mystery 4, is the commercial goals of the sponsors. There are two. There is S T Corporation, which makes a wide range of household goods and Fumakilla which makes things like insecticides. What on earth is the association between go and fly spray and geriatrics? It's women in Japan who buy the hosuehold goods and pesticide cans, anyway. I sense a possible explanation in the fact that the semi-finals of this knockout event are to be held in Hiroshima. Hiroshima is the area of Japan that is probably the most go devout and full of the strongest amateurs. It may be that one or both of the companies has a big presence in Hiroshima, though as far as I know they are both headquartered in Tokyo. The executives may be go players from Hiroshima but these are companies with shareholders, not private fiefdoms. So there may even be hidden motives, such as finding a way to lobby the go-mad prime minister. One way or another, a bit of a mystery. What do you make of this deuced problem, Watson? And, by the way, Mrs Hudson, we shan't be staying for tea.

Author:	tj86430 [ Sun Jan 30, 2011 5:44 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
From the subject line I thought you are talking about a tournament for veterinaries

Author:	hyperpape [ Sun Jan 30, 2011 6:37 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
I thought of military vets, which might have been even stranger, given the role f the military in post-war Japan. I guess Cho will be a pretty big favorite here.

Author:	gowan [ Sun Jan 30, 2011 7:41 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
I'm guessing that it is, as you said, at least partly a nostalgia thing. In the USA there are golf tournaments for "senior" players most of whom have won their share of tournaments and thus are not hurting for money. But the fans like to see their old favorites play so I think it supports fandom. I for one am excited about the new go tournament because I might get to see my old favorites play just like in the old days. Will we see a return of the Chikurin days? Will Ishida (Yoshio) make a come-back? By the way, what are the playing conditions? Will it be rapid play?

Author:	hyperpape [ Sun Jan 30, 2011 8:03 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
Chikurin days?

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Author:	TMark [ Sun Jan 30, 2011 8:27 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
hyperpape wrote: Chikurin days? A combination of the characters of Rin Kaiho and Otake Hideo's names. Best wishes.

Author:	John Fairbairn [ Sun Jan 30, 2011 8:43 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
gowan: It's not Mickey Mouse time limits, as the equivalent events are in China and Korea. Japan may be losing out on international titles but at least they are keeping standards up. 2 hours each, of which the last 5 minutes is byoyomi. The contestants are Cho Chikun (54), Ishida Yoshio (52), Rin (58), Otake (58), Kobayashi Koichi (58), O Rissei (52), Kobayasho Satoru (51), Takemiya (60), Kudo (70), Hane Yasumasa (66) and Kataoka (52). So, apart from Chikurin, we've got the possibility of extending the Cho-Kobayashi saga and the possibility of a Takemiya-Kobayashi Subway Series. You know, looking back at that list, you have to say the old days weren't at all bad. The final is in the summer. Let's hope the oldies remember which day the games are on!

Author:	tj86430 [ Sun Jan 30, 2011 9:02 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
John Fairbairn wrote: Let's hope the oldies remember which day the games are on! Come on, the oldest participant is 70. It's not like they have one foot in the grave.

Author:	mw42 [ Sun Jan 30, 2011 9:47 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
What? No Go Seigen?

Author:	Javaness [ Sun Jan 30, 2011 10:14 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
Sounds like somebody wanted to see their favourite players

Author:	hyperpape [ Sun Jan 30, 2011 11:31 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
Rin and Otake are also 68, btw.

Author:	Joaz Banbeck [ Sun Jan 30, 2011 11:40 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
John Fairbairn wrote: ... The biggest bafflement, Mystery 4, is the commercial goals of the sponsors. There are two. There is S T Corporation, which makes a wide range of household goods and Fumakilla which makes things like insecticides. What on earth is the association between go and fly spray and geriatrics? It's women in Japan who buy the hosuehold goods and pesticide cans, anyway... I don't know that this has to be resolved in terms of commercial goals. Sometimes it is personal goals. Sure, we expect truck and beer commercials during football games because the marketing people have determined that their audience can be found there, but sometimes it is the personal whim of management. Sometimes it just happens that the owner/manager of company X really likes sport Y. I recall in the 70s amd 80s, Church's Fried Chicken sponsored chess. They funded the Southwest Open, and exhibition tours. There is no clear connection between chess and chicken that I can see.

Author:	gowan [ Sun Jan 30, 2011 12:16 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
hyperpape wrote: Chikurin days? TMark is correct. Around 40 years ago there was a stretch of years when Otake and Rin dominated the Meijin tournament, which was then the top title in Japan. Some journalist or other dubbed that period "chikurin" based on readings of characters from the two players' surnames, 竹 (chiku from Otake) and 林 (rin). 竹林 (Chikurin) is an actual word in Japanese, meaning bamboo thicket.

Author:	Vance [ Wed Mar 23, 2011 3:26 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
Does anyone know the exact schedule for these games? Are whether they can be watched live somewhere?

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Author:	mw42 [ Wed Mar 23, 2011 6:16 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
http://igokisen.web.fc2.com/im.html Here is the tournament table and the results thus far. Two matches are scheduled to take place on 24 March.

Author:	HKA [ Wed Mar 23, 2011 6:18 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
Personally, I think it is a wonderful idea. And, with an aging go population still rooting for the favorites of their youth, it seems like a commercial no brainer, to the extent anything go related is a commercial no brainer. Too bad Shuko did not live long enough to continue his "first time title winner" habit. And, if I still wore my quizmaster hat, I would challenge you all to name which player would be next to join the field - he appears to have missed the cut by a matter of months... Finally it is hard for my brain to comprehend that O Rissei who thrashed me at ping pong at the first go congress and seemed like such a kid - is now a veteran.

Author:	TMark [ Wed Mar 23, 2011 7:53 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
HKA wrote: Finally it is hard for my brain to comprehend that O Rissei who thrashed me at ping pong at the first go congress and seemed like such a kid - is now a veteran. I can top that, having played Cho Chikun at table tennis in the basement garage of the Nihon Ki-in! I'm sure that I lost, but it was more to let the young pros let off steam than to play serious games. Best wishes.

Author:	pwaldron [ Wed Mar 23, 2011 8:21 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
HKA wrote: And, if I still wore my quizmaster hat, I would challenge you all to name which player would be next to join the field - he appears to have missed the cut by a matter of months... So as not to ruin it for others... Based on a fast search I'm going for O Meien, who turns 50 in November and who won the Honinbo title in 2000 and 2001.

Author:	Kirby [ Wed Mar 23, 2011 8:56 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
I think we'd welcome a quizmaster here on L19...

Author:	Horibe [ Wed Mar 23, 2011 12:08 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Mysterious new vets tournament
John Fairbairn wrote: The contestants are Cho Chikun (54), Ishida Yoshio (52), Rin (58), Otake (58), Kobayashi Koichi (58), O Rissei (52), Kobayasho Satoru (51), Takemiya (60), Kudo (70), Hane Yasumasa (66) and Kataoka (52). These ages seem wrong - particularly Ishida and Rin...They played in the 1971 Honinbo...which would make Ishida 12 and Rin 18 at the time...