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New 3-3 Joseki by Elf and Leela Zero
http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=15707
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Author:  Gomoto [ Mon May 07, 2018 12:02 pm ]
Post subject:  New 3-3 Joseki by Elf and Leela Zero

This joseki by Elf and Leelaz only appears in 3 games in my pro database:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . 4 . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . 2 X 3 . . |
$$ . . . 5 . 1 O . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ------------------+[/go]


Played by Elf, Leelaz, and Cho

additional Info:
Cho Chikun 9p - Rin Kaiho 9p, W+0.5 (Komi 5.5)
8th Japanese Kisei, title match #6, 1984-03-07
Commentary in Go World 36


What do you think?

Author:  Ian Butler [ Mon May 07, 2018 12:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New 3-3 Joseki by Elf and Leela Zero

First thing that comes in my head is that it's relatively slow for white, but still I like white better in this position than black. (of course, the rest of the board is too important to judge it quarantined)
I feel R5 is an important point later on for both players.

On the other hand, white has invested one extra stone here, so his advantage might not be worth a stone.

Anyway, for a Kyu player, I'd say white has the better position, because we have a hard time using these black stones to the max advantage. While playing as white is "simpler" for a kyu player :)



But I'm just a DDK so don't take my opinion too seriously :lol:

Author:  Jujube [ Mon May 07, 2018 1:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New 3-3 Joseki by Elf and Leela Zero

Didn't imamura toshiya play something like this in the recent nhk match against yamashiro hiroshi?

Author:  EdLee [ Mon May 07, 2018 1:52 pm ]
Post subject: 

Quote:
Didn't imamura toshiya play something like this in the recent nhk match against yamashiro hiroshi?
Good call.
Variation:
Attachment:
IMG_0614.PNG
IMG_0614.PNG [ 447.35 KiB | Viewed 6499 times ]

Author:  John Fairbairn [ Mon May 07, 2018 3:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New 3-3 Joseki by Elf and Leela Zero

Quote:
This joseki by Elf and Leelaz only appears in 3 games in my pro database:


Go Seigen was the first to play it, in 1948.

Once again Go and Alpha no Go is remarkably reminiscent of Sai and Hikaru no Go.

Author:  EdLee [ Mon May 07, 2018 4:30 pm ]
Post subject: 

Quote:
Go Seigen was the first to play it, in 1948.

Once again, [ Go and ( Alpha no Go ) ] is remarkably reminiscent of
[ Sai and ( Hikaru no Go ) ].
Look forward to Babel-fish bots resolving these and parsing 100% correctly. :)

Author:  Gomoto [ Mon May 07, 2018 9:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New 3-3 Joseki by Elf and Leela Zero

Attachment:
translate.jpg
translate.jpg [ 52.73 KiB | Viewed 6406 times ]


It plays go
It translates

Author:  Bill Spight [ Tue May 08, 2018 12:27 am ]
Post subject:  Re: New 3-3 Joseki by Elf and Leela Zero

Murashima Yoshinori :)


Author:  John Fairbairn [ Tue May 08, 2018 12:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: New 3-3 Joseki by Elf and Leela Zero

Yes, Bill, but I make it a rule to consider josekis in an empty quadrant. I know that pros don't ignore the rest of the board even if a quadrant is empty, but even they seem to stick to empty 10/11 x10/11 quadrants in joseki books.

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