Life In 19x19 :: Counting practice exercises?

http://senseis.xmp.net/?SteveFawthrop%2FCounting

If you can wait two or three months, the good news is that I just happen to write a detailed book on positional judgement and evaluating territory, thickness, influence, options, endgames etc.

If you can't wait and want mostly territory counting, read Cho's Positional Judgment High-Speed Game Analysis http://senseis.xmp.net/?PositionalJudgm ... meAnalysis
If you can wait two or three months, the good news is that I just happen to write a detailed book on positional judgement and evaluating territory, thickness, influence, options, endgames etc.

This reminds me of an article in the American Go E-Journal, where Michael Redmond 9p says "what I did last year was to copy game positions about 30 moves from the end of the game. [...] I write the result – for instance in this game, White wins by one point – so I have to hold the position in my head and count it, and by doing that, I think I’m improving my reading ability. Not just reading out an endgame, but life and death problems, as well.”

http://www.usgo.org/news/2010/06/michae ... ros-train/

hanekomu wrote:

Here is a picture of the cover: http://www.flickr.com/photos/hanekomu_a ... hotostream

That is one groovy cover, man. :cool:

Author:	brendan.hill [ Sun Sep 23, 2012 11:41 pm ]
Post subject:	Counting practice exercises?
I'd like to work on my counting skills. In particular, to practice precise counting so I can more easily do approximate counting in games. Is there a practice resource available for this? For example - show a group/board, you count then it shows you or you pick the answer. Like goproblems.com but for counting. I looked around and couldn't find any thing on the internet (maybe most people would find this tragically boring) but I would be willing to pay a small fee for it. Maybe one way is to load random games on KGS, go to the end, count then compare to Score Estimator - seems a but clumsy though. Any other suggestions? -Brendan

Author:	p2501 [ Sun Sep 23, 2012 11:47 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Counting practice exercises?
There are 9x9 endgame tsumego.

Author:	daal [ Mon Sep 24, 2012 1:30 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Counting practice exercises?
This isn't exactly what you're looking for, but you might find it useful anyway. It's a series of lessons on counting by DrStraw that he gave a few years back. http://senseis.xmp.net/?SteveFawthrop%2FCounting

Author:	RobertJasiek [ Mon Sep 24, 2012 2:08 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Counting practice exercises?
If you can't wait and want mostly territory counting, read Cho's Positional Judgment High-Speed Game Analysis http://senseis.xmp.net/?PositionalJudgm ... meAnalysis If you can wait two or three months, the good news is that I just happen to write a detailed book on positional judgement and evaluating territory, thickness, influence, options, endgames etc. Practicing counting is the easy part. The difficult part is to know what to count and under which conditions it may be counted or when simple counting is misleading. Then helping methods such as quiescence become necessary.

Author:	RobertJasiek [ Mon Sep 24, 2012 3:35 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Counting practice exercises?
daal wrote: http://senseis.xmp.net/?SteveFawthrop%2FCounting The general ideas contained in it are useful but I disagree to which intersections he assesses as territory, to the counts and to his heuristics for these purposes.

Life In 19x19 http://www.lifein19x19.com/

Counting practice exercises? http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=6821	Page 1 of 1

Author:	daal [ Mon Sep 24, 2012 4:51 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Counting practice exercises?
RobertJasiek wrote: If you can wait two or three months, the good news is that I just happen to write a detailed book on positional judgement and evaluating territory, thickness, influence, options, endgames etc. Nice to hear! Sounds like you're on a roll ^^

Author:	brendan.hill [ Mon Sep 24, 2012 6:49 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Counting practice exercises?
RobertJasiek wrote: If you can't wait and want mostly territory counting, read Cho's Positional Judgment High-Speed Game Analysis http://senseis.xmp.net/?PositionalJudgm ... meAnalysis If you can wait two or three months, the good news is that I just happen to write a detailed book on positional judgement and evaluating territory, thickness, influence, options, endgames etc. Maybe I'll have my cake and eat it too by doing both! :p

Author:	pwaldron [ Mon Sep 24, 2012 11:13 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Counting practice exercises?
You might pick up a copy of the Train Like a Pro series, if it's still available. There are a number of excellent full-board endgame problems on 13x13 boards. Your job is to read out the last 20 or so moves in the game and figure out the final game result. Highly recommended.

Author:	speedchase [ Mon Sep 24, 2012 4:31 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Counting practice exercises?
I would recommend positional judgement by cho chikun

Author:	mrnoob [ Mon Sep 24, 2012 5:51 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Counting practice exercises?
Why not just get a random pro game that you know ends within 5 or so points and count that? You can count it at the end position to start, and slowly take some moves off and estimate. As a bonus, you also get to learn good endgame moves.

Author:	RobertJasiek [ Tue Sep 25, 2012 2:25 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Counting practice exercises?
hanekomu wrote: And a sample: http://www.flickr.com/photos/hanekomu_a ... hotostream It is good to see that that book determines Current Territory.

Author:	p2501 [ Tue Sep 25, 2012 2:59 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Counting practice exercises?
hanekomu wrote: This reminds me of an article in the American Go E-Journal, where Michael Redmond 9p says "what I did last year was to copy game positions about 30 moves from the end of the game. [...] I write the result – for instance in this game, White wins by one point – so I have to hold the position in my head and count it, and by doing that, I think I’m improving my reading ability. Not just reading out an endgame, but life and death problems, as well.” http://www.usgo.org/news/2010/06/michae ... ros-train/ Interesting, I think I will give this a trial.

Author:	Phelan [ Tue Sep 25, 2012 4:24 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Counting practice exercises?
hanekomu wrote: Here is a picture of the cover: http://www.flickr.com/photos/hanekomu_a ... hotostream That is one groovy cover, man.

Author:	p2501 [ Tue Sep 25, 2012 4:25 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Counting practice exercises?
Endgame problems from senseis: http://senseis.xmp.net/?EndgameProblems http://senseis.xmp.net/?PracticalEndgameTests

Author:	Numsgil [ Mon Oct 01, 2012 5:44 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Counting practice exercises?
An interesting idea would be to do a search over your old games and find all the ones that were 0.5 point wins/losses, or at least pretty close, and take the final board position and make those in to problems. I still find it possible to count the same -finished- board position 2 or 3 times and get 2 or 3 slightly different counts, especially when you factor in captured stones and komi; it's just really easy to lose track of a point here or there (on that subject, if I have to count playing cards to make sure I have all 52 I usually count twice because about 25% of the time I'll count wrong and have to do a best 2 of 3, so the core problem might be that I just suck at counting things in general). I've been meaning to do this with my own games at some point but I've been super lazy. If I manage it at some point I might post it here.

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Author:	Kanin [ Tue Sep 25, 2012 8:26 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Counting practice exercises?
Phelan wrote: hanekomu wrote: Here is a picture of the cover: http://www.flickr.com/photos/hanekomu_a ... hotostream That is one groovy cover, man. I love it! Laughed a lot and for long time when I saw it. Awesome.