Life In 19x19
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Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=715		 Page 1 of 3
Author:  Solomon [ Tue Jun 01, 2010 11:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
For those who are unaware of this forum game, refer to this thread. Rules will be remain the same from last time, except that instead of 4 games I will post 5 (so you can get 50 points per round instead of 40). Also, this forum game will be part of a 5-game series. I will be keeping track of everyone's scores, so that at the very end the person who has the highest count wins (I may also consider prizes for 2nd and 3rd place). Each forum game will last for a duration of 2 weeks, so for this series the deadline to post your answers is June 12th. The solutions will be posted on June 14th, and the next round will begin on June 15th.

Also, again I'd like to emphasize to please keep the format to something like this (and make sure it's hidden):

  1. 6d
  2. 5k
  3. 9d
  4. 10k
  5. 3d

I should mention that all games are guaranteed to be higher-levelled than 15k. Also, one small change: Instead of writing down "Pro", just write "9d". Any game I post that is either played between KGS/Tygem 9d or between two professional players fall under this category. I think "Pro" caused some confusion from last time, so yeah just write "9d" if you think the game was played between two pros or two top online players.

I will make sure that if the game was played online, it's a game played between two well known and high class 9d players in a non-blitz game; e.g: MilanMilan 9d from KGS or swing(P) 9d from Tygem. I will define "non-blitz" as any game that has byoyomi of 20 seconds or greater with 3 or more periods, though this is the minimum and most games will usually be something like 20-40 minute main time with 30-60 second byoyomi, 3-5 periods.

If I put up a pro game (or any game for that matter) and you happen to recognize it and who it was played by, please keep it to yourself and don't write down such information. If I find anyone doing this, I won't disqualify since this is just a forum game...but I may edit the post to remove the information (yes, even if it's hidden because people peak and it's natural).

Tentative Prize:
Image

And as I've mentioned earlier, there will be a prize at the end of the 5-game series. Ideas are running low right now, but I promise it'll be nice so give it your best shot :). Currently, I am thinking about giving away Cho Hye Yeon's "Creative Life and Death" Vol.1. If anyone has any other ideas, let me know - I may also set up a Paypal prize fund so I don't have to pay for everything >__<.

Anyways, games are below; I look forward to reading the analysis. One final note: I noticed in some of the analysis for the last thread, some of the messages were a bit harsh :/. Please be constructive and no bashing on the level of the players if you think it's low; you could also end up looking like a donk for bashing on a game that you think was played between two 10ks, only to find out it was Gu Li 9p vs. Lee Sedol 9p, so tread carefully ;).

GAME 1


GAME 2


GAME 3


GAME 4


GAME 5
Author:  Harleqin [ Wed Jun 02, 2010 1:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
According to my calculations...
1. 2d
2. 4k
3. 6d
4. 1k
5. 1d
Author:  Kirby [ Wed Jun 02, 2010 6:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
Helel wrote:
Have you considered using something written by John Fairbairn as prize? If it could be arranged to be signed by him for the occasion I think most people here would find it an awesome prize.


I personally prefer the proposed tentative prize.

By the way, Araban, for online games you've chosen, could you let us know if they are from Tygem only, KGS only, or a mix? I know you can't directly compare ranks between the serevers, but the information cold be useful...
Author:  Solomon [ Wed Jun 02, 2010 7:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
Kirby wrote:
By the way, Araban, for online games you've chosen, could you let us know if they are from Tygem only, KGS only, or a mix? I know you can't directly compare ranks between the serevers, but the information cold be useful...

All games are from KGS unless it's 9d level, in which case it may either be from KGS or from Tygem or a live game between two professionals.
Author:  daniel_the_smith [ Wed Jun 02, 2010 7:30 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
1. 4d
2. 9k
3. 2d
4. 8d
5. 1d

Reasoning:

1. They get into trouble I wouldn't have gotten into using moves I wouldn't have seen. Stronger than me, not pro.
2. Premature tenukis, inefficient shapes. A lot of clear mistakes. I'm going with 9k because I saw move 45 and thought "that's an 8 or 9k move"
3. I don't think players much weaker would find 51, and I don't think players much stronger would die so horribly.
4. All the moves seem to flow into each other. It's probably a pro game, but I can't quite convince myself that black lost all those stones in white's territory on purpose.
5. I'm not sure about 43. 197 proves it's not a pro game to me. Then black loses some stones in the upper left. I think I might be able to give these guys a run for their money.

I'm a little concerned that I just suggested 4/5 are dan level games. Let's see what everyone else thinks...
Author:  blue [ Wed Jun 02, 2010 7:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
1. 5d
2. 8k
3. 1d
4. 2k
5. 5k
Author:  sparvel [ Wed Jun 02, 2010 7:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
    3k
    2k
    1d
    3d
    7k
Author:  Chew Terr [ Wed Jun 02, 2010 7:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
I should use a random number generator, so as to improve my accuracy =D
Author:  Kirby [ Wed Jun 02, 2010 8:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
Helel wrote:
Obviously I was wrong and only losers read Fairbairn. Since I'm totally clueless I will refrain from taking any furter part of this thread.


I guess you could only be responding to my comment...

I was simply stating my personal preference. I was not trying to imply that anybody was a "loser".
Author:  Solomon [ Wed Jun 02, 2010 8:31 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
Helel wrote:
Obviously I was wrong and only losers read Fairbairn. Since I'm totally clueless I will refrain from taking any furter part of this thread.

I'm not familiar with Fairbairn's work (other than the titles of what he has released and a bit of a description), so I didn't want to respond to your post until I did some research on his books and whether the idea could work or not.

Sorry, but I think you're being a tad too sensitive here.
Author:  Magicwand [ Wed Jun 02, 2010 9:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
i edited before the expiration:
1. 9d
2. 5k
3. 5D
4. 2k
5. 12k
Author:  phrax [ Wed Jun 02, 2010 9:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
1. 9d
2. 2d
3. 10k
4. 1k
5. 12k
Author:  illluck [ Thu Jun 03, 2010 7:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
game 1: 4d
game 2: 7k
game 3: 3k
game 4: 1d
game 5: 4k
Author:  Zwergesel [ Fri Jun 04, 2010 6:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
1. 1d
2. 5k
3. 4d
4. 7d
5. 9k
Author:  Marcus [ Fri Jun 04, 2010 7:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
No time to explain why I feel this way, but here are my guesses:

1) 3d
2) 7d
3) 2k
4) 4k
5) 9d

Bet I get at least 1 zero on this one. :)
Author:  ratata [ Fri Jun 04, 2010 1:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
1. 2d
2. 3k
3. 9d
4. 10k
5. 4k
Author:  tj86430 [ Fri Jun 04, 2010 2:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
1. 2k
2. 7k
3. 5k
4. 10k
5. 9k

1. Some moves seem strange to me, but no really big blunders. A couple of nice tesujis. Intense fighting leading to resignation. Probably not dan, but might be fairly close.

2. Like watching myself play. I even had to check that it wasn't in fact my game!

3. Strange game. In the opening there are a lot of sequences I find not so skillful, OTOH some plays are quite nice. White seems to resign quite soon (I would have at least tried to kill B A15 group). Black seems stronger than white, but since they must be of same strength I'll judge by black's play and assume white had a bad day.

4. A lot of bad moves, but still overall somewhat solid. Weaker than me, but not significantly

5. Again mixed feelings. Somewhat competent, but still moves that seem like big mistakes. No clear sense of direction or urgency. Black was clearly winning but still white didn't resign.
Author:  Kirby [ Fri Jun 04, 2010 4:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
I am terrible at this game, but here are my guesses:
Game 1: 3d
Game 2: 4k
Game 3: 9d
Game 4: 2d
Game 5: 1d
Author:  unkx80 [ Sun Jun 06, 2010 1:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
Here are my wild guesses. I've never been accurate in such things.

1. 9d
2. 3k
3. 6d
4. 4d
5. 5k

Game 1: The early moves have a strong pro feel. But black must have overlooked W62.

Game 2: B13, B19, and B21 are very kyuish. Also, B15 should not tenuki. White seems a bit stronger than black, but his reading isn't so great either.

Game 3: This game is difficult to assess. Given the first 22 moves, looks like at least a mid-dan game. Is W28 an experiment? Black shows excellent reading skills in the remainder of the game.

Game 4: W28 is interesting, probably not a move easily found by kyu players. What is B47? But black's invasion at the bottom is skilful.

Game 5: Moves like B9 and W20 are very kyuish. Somehow, I thought white seems a bit stronger, but black won by such a large margin.
Author:  Dusk Eagle [ Wed Jun 09, 2010 4:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Strength Analysis Forum Game - Series 1
I admit the slack deadline made me put this off for a little bit.

9d. The upper-right joseki seems to be played exclusively by the strongest players. Also, it just had a whole 9d feel to it, with white being sure of his ability to kill the top black group throughout the game.
11k. This was a weak game.
1k. I know I've played a few disaster games like this.
6k. Plenty of easy-to-spot mistakes.
8k. Plenty of easy (for me) misreads and just plain dumb shapes.

I did pretty well last time... let's see if these predictions are accurate. It's hard to guess the strength of games several stones weaker than yourself, other than saying "SDK" or "DDK". Then again, it's also hard to judge the strength of games several stones stronger than oneself. However, I am confident that the only game stronger than me is played between two 8ds or 9d/pros *sets self up for egg in face*.
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