Fun tsumego problem

dfan · #1

From Takeo Shinji's Strongest Tsumego for Shodan, Mid Kyu and Low Kyu (link to tchan's godiscussions' post) amazon.co.jp link

I made an amazon.co.jp order a few months back to get the Maeda set and threw in a bunch of these pocket-sized books. They're great.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$c Black to play $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . . . . . | $$ . . . . . X X X X | $$ . . X X X O O O O | $$ . . X O O X O O . | $$ . . . . . X . . . | $$ -----------------[/go]

Put your answer in hide tags, of course!

Chew Terr · #2

Edit: changed attempt. Thanks for the hint, Bill!

Bill Spight · #3

Hint.

Redundant · #4

Fun!

tchan001 · #5

daniel_the_smith · #6

That one seemed impossible the first time I saw it, I'll never forget it...

fwiffo · #7

Reminds me of this classic:

deja · #8

Wouldn't this work as well?

daniel_the_smith · #9

@deja

deja · **#10**

Am I missing something? I'm sure I am...

daniel_the_smith · **#11**

Right, so white makes a ko threat...

deja · **#12**

daniel_the_smith wrote:

Right, so white makes a ko threat...

But wherever white moves next, black just takes that group, no?

daniel_the_smith · **#13**

Well, that would depend on the size of the threat and the rest of the board

averell · **#14**

Chew Terr wrote:

Edit: changed attempt. Thanks for the hint, Bill!

Nakamura · **#15**

Reminds me of the Golden Chicken Standing on One Leg. ^_^

Best named tesuji ever.

Cool problem, but I solved it. So it must be really easy. I never get hard ones. o.o

dfan · **#16**

deja wrote:

daniel_the_smith wrote:

Right, so white makes a ko threat...

But wherever white moves next, black just takes that group, no?

What if white's next move threatens to capture 40 stones? Do you still just take the lower right group?

Here's a more quantitative way to look at it than just "killing is better than ko":

In your solution, the sequence goes bwbWbW, where uppercase letters are moves played elsewhere on the board.
In the correct solution, the sequence goes bwbW (or bW, if White stops thrashing).

In both cases, both players have played the same number of moves as each other. But in your solution, white has gotten to play an extra stone somewhere else on the board for free (two capital W's instead of one).

deja · **#17**

dfan wrote:

deja wrote:

daniel_the_smith wrote:

Right, so white makes a ko threat...

But wherever white moves next, black just takes that group, no?

What if white's next move threatens to capture 40 stones? Do you still just take the lower right group?

Here's a more quantitative way to look at it than just "killing is better than ko":

In your solution, the sequence goes bwbWbW, where uppercase letters are moves played elsewhere on the board.
In the correct solution, the sequence goes bwbW (or bW, if White stops thrashing).

In both cases, both players have played the same number of moves as each other. But in your solution, white has gotten to play an extra stone somewhere else on the board for free (two capital W's instead of one).

I was looking at the problem from a local position only, since we have no idea what else is on the board. So "wherever white moves next" was in the context of white trying to save the two groups.

Solomon · **#18**

When you see and solve this problem the first time, it really is hard to forget it because the solution, while not particularly difficult, is just so cute.

SoDesuNe · **#19**

Yeah, I also had a hard time with this problem in "Graded Go Problems For Beginners Volume 3". There were like a handful with this tactic. Pretty astonishing =)

k43r · **#20**

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Similar problem, but from real kgs game. B to kill ^^ (solution wasn't played in game, kibitz found it)

Fun tsumego problem

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