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Need an amazon recommendation
http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=3170		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  nedpatrick [ Wed Feb 09, 2011 9:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Need an amazon recommendation
I am placing an order on Amazon for Go for Beginners by Kaoru Iwamoto. I need to add one more book to get free shipping on my order. The problem with Amazon is many of their go books are not in stock. I already own the first 2 Janice Kim books, Teach Yourself Go, and The Second Book of Go. I would like some suggestions as to which one of the following books I should add. I am a beginner and realize that I might not be ready for some of these books right away.

In The Beginning (Elementary Go Series)
Janice Kim's IVth book
38 Basic Joseki

Those three books are in stock at Amazon. I would like people's opinions as to which one they would add to my collection. Thanks.

Ned
Author:  daniel_the_smith [ Wed Feb 09, 2011 9:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Need an amazon recommendation
If Graded Go Problems for Beginners vol II is in stock, get that. Maybe vol I if you're really 30k :)

I've not read the three books you mention. You really need a problem book.
Author:  Joaz Banbeck [ Wed Feb 09, 2011 9:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Need an amazon recommendation
If you need Janice Kim's I and II, you are probably not ready for IV. And 'In the Beginning' overlaps much with 'Go for Beginners'. But you will need some basic josekis to keep from getting clobbered in the opening, and allow you to learn about the middle game by getting in to it on an even footing. I recommend 38 Basic Joseki.
Author:  Redbeard [ Wed Feb 09, 2011 11:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Need an amazon recommendation
I would suggest Graded Go Problems Vol 2 as well, but it is listed on Amazon as New for $199.99 :o Something is seriously wrong there.

Go to http://www.kiseido.com to buy the Graded Go Problems series for $21.00 per book. For now, I would recommend holding off on Joseki until you are SDK. If you need a book on Amazon get Tesuji or Life and Death.
Author:  LovroKlc [ Thu Feb 10, 2011 6:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Need an amazon recommendation
Redbeard wrote:
I would suggest Graded Go Problems Vol 2 as well, but it is listed on Amazon as New for $199.99 :o Something is seriously wrong there.

Go to http://www.kiseido.com to buy the Graded Go Problems series for $21.00 per book. For now, I would recommend holding off on Joseki until you are SDK. If you need a book on Amazon get Tesuji or Life and Death.



I would recommend tesuji over L&D
Author:  Nagilum [ Thu Feb 10, 2011 6:36 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Need an amazon recommendation
Hi, welcome to the world of go.

Before you spend money on the so-called first book like "Go for beginners" i want you present some alternatives:

The rules ( a simple version) : http://senseis.xmp.net/?RulesOfGoIntroductory
All the essential stuff that a beginner needs: for playing:
The interactive way to go. http://playgo.to/iwtg/en/
A lot of problems for the beginner: http://gochild2009.appspot.com/
A FREE english pdf-book for beginners, if you still think, that you need another book: http://hannes.30mb.de/Downloads/usagi1a.pdf

If you are already familiar with rules, you just need just a lot of games to make fast progress. The 9x9 and 13x13 are both very good for this purpose.
New techniques you will discover easily when you are solving some beginner problems.

If you still want to spend money on some books you should buy "Tesuji" and "Life and death" both from James Davis. Although much but not everything of the content is too hard for you ( at the moment ) you will learn from these books for a long time. Particular "Tesuji" is very, very good.
Nevertheless "Go for beginners" is also a good book. If you don't like the whole online stuff and want a good "Step by step beginner"-book it is good choice for your bookshelf.
Author:  gaius [ Thu Feb 10, 2011 7:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Need an amazon recommendation
Joaz Banbeck wrote:
I recommend 38 Basic Joseki.
WHAT? That book is pretty useless if you ask me... Much too advanced for a beginner (in fact, I think you need almost no joseki at all in the beginning), and once you are about 2-3 kyu and joseki study starts becoming somewhat worthwhile, it's not nearly comprehensive enough. Iwamoto's book is excellent (though not as easy as you might think), and it has like 2 josekis in it. Those will do just fine for now - you'll pick joseki up as you go along, especially if you review your games :)

Of course, these are only my two cents, but I'd recommend playing many games, and maybe picking up something like one of the Graded Go Problems for Beginners series. If you prefer reading a text about Go rather than a problem book, In the Beginning is not bad, but Fundamentals of Go by Kageyama Toshiro is also highly praised by many - recommended!
Author:  jdl [ Thu Feb 10, 2011 11:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Need an amazon recommendation
Yeah, I'm really just now starting to get something out of 38 Basic Joseki. It's a good book, but not for a new player.

Janice Kim book #2 and Graded Go Problems #2 are my standard suggestions for newbies who want to get started. Also, Guo Juan's "Step-by-step course" lectures start out very basic and were a big help for me.
Author:  rubin427 [ Thu Feb 10, 2011 11:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Need an amazon recommendation
If you are looking for a go novel, try "First Kyu" by Sung-Hwa Hong.
Author:  nedpatrick [ Thu Feb 10, 2011 5:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Need an amazon recommendation
jdl wrote:

Janice Kim book #2 and Graded Go Problems #2 are my standard suggestions for newbies who want to get started.


Can you skip Graded Go problems #1? I've done the elementary problems on http://www.goproblems.com/.
Author:  Joaz Banbeck [ Thu Feb 10, 2011 6:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Need an amazon recommendation
gaius wrote:
Joaz Banbeck wrote:
I recommend 38 Basic Joseki.
WHAT? That book is pretty useless if you ask me... Much too advanced for a beginner (in fact, I think you need almost no joseki at all in the beginning)...


I'm not recommending 38 Basic Joseki merely for the OP's opening, I'm recommending it for his middle game too. All too often, beginners are trying to learn all phases of the game simultaneously. And they get clobbered in joseki, and then go into the middle game way behind. Then they learn all kinds of wrong ideas about the middle game.
It is very difficult to learn how to play a decent middle game when you have seven eyeless groups and two dead ones. So I recommend 38 Basic Joseki so that he can go into the middle game on an equal footing.

gaius wrote:
... Fundamentals of Go by Kageyama Toshiro is also highly praised by many - recommended!


@ the OP: We agree on this. Sooner or later you MUST get 'Fundamentals of Go'.
Author:  topazg [ Fri Feb 11, 2011 6:58 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Need an amazon recommendation
I personally would recommend both 38 josekis and opening theory made easy to go hand in hand (and endorse Kageyama's fundamental principles too).

I think people underestimate the importance of a beginner feeling like he can play with purpose. Sure, joseki precision is relatively unimportant for a beginner, but "thinking you know what to play locally" is hugely important psychologically, even if you later find out your knowledge is flawed. Having a strong grasp of something that you think is locally good to do makes the world of difference to the satisfaction a beginner can get from the game, and without it it's easy to feel lost about what to do next. As the opening is so important, the three books recommended recently (that I started this post with) mean that a beginner should never feel like they have no idea what to do next, and that is priceless.

As they get stronger, they'll start asking specifically for material to help with specific areas that they have started to grasp an understanding of what they are and what they are for.
Author:  daniel_the_smith [ Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Need an amazon recommendation
nedpatrick wrote:
jdl wrote:

Janice Kim book #2 and Graded Go Problems #2 are my standard suggestions for newbies who want to get started.


Can you skip Graded Go problems #1? I've done the elementary problems on http://www.goproblems.com/.


#1 is reallllly easy, but would probably be appropriate for someone who has just learned the rules and not much else.
Author:  judicata [ Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Need an amazon recommendation
I stayed away from 38 Basic Joseki for awhile because I heard, over and over again, that it is not helpful for DDKs.

I completely agree that memorizing joseki is NOT a good way to improve, but 38 Basic Joseki is not about memorozing patterns. When I read it around 12 kyu, I found it immensely helpful--particularly with basic shapes, group safety, and overall judgment. I seriously doubt it would be helpful for true beginners (at least up to 14 kyu or so), but it really is a good book.
Author:  nedpatrick [ Sun Feb 13, 2011 9:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Need an amazon recommendation
Thanks for the advice, everyone. I eschewed free shipping and ordered Graded Go Problems Vol. 1 & 2.
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