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What to buy for christmas?
http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=7076		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  NoSkill [ Tue Oct 30, 2012 3:09 pm ]
Post subject:  What to buy for christmas?
I get around 500-600$ for christmas.

So im thinking 300$ for 6 months of baduk TV with english subtitles from gogameguru.com with 100$ for go books, 100$ for sgf game reviews, and 100$ for non-go stuff.

For the 100$ of books, i dont know what to buy. I already have:

Lessons in the fundamentals of go
Modern fuseki: Korean style
Lee Changho tesuji set
Invincible
Life and death elementary go series
Tesuji elementary go series
Attack and defense elementary go series

So really, I dont know. I heard about the Lee Seedol commented book, but its 45$ and its only 3 games?

What would you recommend to take me from 1D-6D as i improve?

And is there anyone you know who does good sgf reviews of games for 5$-10$?
Author:  NoSkill [ Tue Oct 30, 2012 3:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
Also im wondering if the yungusend dojang is better than the Baduk TV english subtitled, because with the yunguseng you get great reviews that i really like (crowis is amazing) and they are of your own games, but with baduk TV english you get videos more often and more of them. I watched the baduk TV english demo video, and learned alot. But i also like crowis's group.

Anyone tried one of these and not liked or liked them?
Author:  oren [ Tue Oct 30, 2012 3:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
NoSkill wrote:
So really, I dont know. I heard about the Lee Seedol commented book, but its 45$ and its only 3 games?


Yes, but it is far more detailed than any comparable book out there. I have a lot of go books and it's the best bang for the buck out there. I'm looking forward to the next two being published in English.

Other book recommendations would be John Fairbairn's books on Go Seigen starting with Kamakura.

I have gogameguru Baduk TV in English, but it's certainly hard to say that the $50 wouldn't be better on instruction if your goal is to get stronger. If it's to get stronger and entertained, it's a good value.
Author:  Kirby [ Tue Oct 30, 2012 5:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
I'd get a few problem set books and spend the rest on pro lessons.
Author:  NoSkill [ Tue Oct 30, 2012 5:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
Kirby wrote:
I'd get a few problem set books and spend the rest on pro lessons.


Right. But I already have a problem set, so im thinking maybe just buy Lee Seedol commented games then get either:

A: Baduk TV in english for 6 months (1 new video every few days I think? Along with the directory of old ones), kgs+ for a year, and 100$ worth of game reviews.

B: 6 month in yunguseng dojang (5 games a month all reviewed+ 3 lectures in general a month+ watch other peoples reviews) and Lee Seedol book and kgs+ for a year.


So really im thinking about getting the leeseedol book and kgs+ for a year with either yungusend dojang or baduktv for a year.

Oren, do you think the baduk tv english will help me improve more than the yunguseng from your experince with baduktv?
Can you tell me how often they update their videos/how long they are/what you get access to? Their site says but I want to confirm if true
Author:  oren [ Tue Oct 30, 2012 5:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
NoSkill wrote:
Oren, do you think the baduk tv english will help me improve more than the yunguseng from your experince with baduktv?
Can you tell me how often they update their videos/how long they are/what you get access to?


I think Yunguseng if you take it seriously is probably better for improvement. Why not just get one month of Baduk TV English? You can then watch all the old episodes as well. They add a new video every couple days it seems. You can check all the videos they have without an account and they list the posted date.

You get access to everything. The games are generally about an hour long and there are two baduk lesson series where each episode is about 20 min.

If possible, I would do one month of Baduk TV English and do the rest on Yunguseng or professional lessons.
Author:  Dokuganryu [ Wed Oct 31, 2012 1:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
Depending on Your goals You could consider yearly account on Gua Juan school. I guess for someone who is serious about improvement it would be the best "bang for the buck". Tons of knowledge that You can repeat for a whole year.
Author:  gowan [ Wed Oct 31, 2012 4:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
I'd consider the dan-level problem series from Kiseido. But, useful though they are, problem books usually get used up in the sense that after you've worked the problems five or six times you don't get much more out of them. For long-term benefit I like game record books. Pro game records never become stale. Even if you know the games very well you can still learn new things from them because, in practice, that level of skill is infinitely far away :)

Pro one-on-one lessons are very beneficial but you have to find a good teacher and you have to put in the effort to study your lessons and think hard about them when you play.
Author:  NoSkill [ Wed Oct 31, 2012 5:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
Well my goal is to become strong amateur or pro some day (im probably too old for this: 16)


For guojuan or yunguseng.... is it better than go books and baduk tv? Is 400$ better spent for go books + a league or just more league?

I would do pro lessons but like pro lesson= 40$ an hr..
Author:  RobertJasiek [ Wed Oct 31, 2012 5:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
Spend $50~100 on books / collections for hard work, keep the remainder until 3d, THEN spend the remainder and additional money 50% on knowledge books and 50% on such teachers being able to identify your then remaining weaknesses immediately. If you do not make it to 3d quickly, consider spending more money until then.
Author:  quantumf [ Wed Oct 31, 2012 6:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
My view:

pro 1-1 lessons > strong amateur 1-1 lessons > leagues (with reviews&lessons e.g. KBA/NGA)

All of the above have the merit of (a) giving you direct information about the mistakes you are making and (b) helping you make sure you put everything into the game. One of my problems, particularly with online games, is a pretty variable effort that I put into the games. When I'm paying for the game, that helps me try my best. It also helps to know that a teacher is going to be angry/disappointed if I don't put everything into every move.

(Note that its possible that some amateurs can do better at teaching than pros, but it seems the Internet does a lousy job of sharing solid information in this regard)

Note that in general the lessons above are never going to be more than occasional, e.g. once or a few times a week. Thus, in order to advance, you'll almost certainly need to do additional study, such as reading practice or knowledge acquisition. So some books will probably be required.
Author:  oren [ Wed Oct 31, 2012 9:27 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
If you go the route of professional lessons, then hold off on books until the teacher gives you recommendations.
Author:  NoSkill [ Wed Oct 31, 2012 10:10 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
oren wrote:
If you go the route of professional lessons, then hold off on books until the teacher gives you recommendations.


Right but any pro lesson seems bad idea...

If i get pro lessons i can get like 5-8 of them, but instead of that I can get 30 of my games reviewed, view over 50 other videos in yunguseng.
Author:  quantumf [ Wed Oct 31, 2012 10:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
NoSkill wrote:
Right but any pro lesson seems bad idea...

If i get pro lessons i can get like 5-8 of them, but instead of that I can get 30 of my games reviewed, view over 50 other videos in yunguseng.


Sure. Having done 1-1 lessons with strong amateur teachers (7d+), I can definitely say that its the surest/quickest route to improvement (and obviously this will be true for pro lessons too). It is quite expensive, however, and I can't really afford to keep it up. My current compromise is to join the NGA - a league system with lessons and reviews. Reviews are great, and help identify your weaknesses, but when you're playing against players more or less your own level, you don't see the amazing ideas and moves of much stronger players.
Author:  smartgo [ Wed Oct 31, 2012 10:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
Have you studied your copy of Invincible from start to finish? If not, I'd recommend getting an iPad mini instead of 6 months of Baduk TV, and learn everything you need from the SmartGo Books version of Invincible. But of course, I'm biased. :-)

More on the economics of SmartGo Books: http://www.smartgo.com/blog/20121023.htm
Author:  oren [ Wed Oct 31, 2012 10:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
smartgo wrote:
Have you studied your copy of Invincible from start to finish? If not, I'd recommend getting an iPad mini instead of 6 months of Baduk TV, and learn everything you need from the SmartGo Books version of Invincible. But of course, I'm biased. :-)


Once it's on the Nexus 7, I would agree! :)
Author:  NoSkill [ Wed Oct 31, 2012 12:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
I have an Ipod and im interested in the smartgobooks. Ive read the previews for all the books and such, but the major drawback for me is simply that is on an ipod.

I dont replay progames even on kgs if i can avoid it, only in real life. So a real hardbook is better for those. Problem books like tesuji i carry with me.

Idea/conceptual books i read in .pdf.

So I really dont have a use for using it on an ipod, but if I didnt have a tesuji set already I would consider doing L&D on the ipod ^^
Author:  gogameguru [ Mon Nov 05, 2012 4:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
Baduk TV has reached the point now where we can afford to offer some other payment options for people who don't want, or can't afford the monthly subscription. We're going to trial day passes for example, so you might prefer to use that and only buy the monhly subscription during school holidays. This should be available before Christmas.

Also, if you're already a dan level player, there are many more videos than just the subtitled ones that should still be easy for you to follow and learn from.

I think we discussed problem books before in another thread and you said you weren't that keen on them? If you really want to get strong, I'd still recommend getting some of the classical problem collections and a dictionary of fundamental life and death shapes to work through. I can explain in detail why if you want me to.

The Shumyo should be a good one for you to start with if you want to.

Unfortunately, most of the really good problem collections still aren't available (or in print) in English, but Yellow Mountain has some books in Chinese and we're looking at setting up a special import service for some of the best problem books. If not by Christmas, we'll have this available early in 2013.

You already have Invincible, so you have plenty of material in terms of pro games. Baduk TV or Lee Sedol would give you a better understanding of the modern game, but Invincible contains the important fundamentals.

My own path from about 1d to 5d (online) consisted mainly of playing games (and reviewing most of them) solving problems (learning reading and techniques) and playing through Invincible (more than 5 times, and more times for the best games). After that I had lessons with pros who helped to me to better understand the modern game and improved about two more stones.

But your way might be different and you should be wary whenever someone prescribes their own autobiography (like I just did :)). There should be a more efficient way than what I did...

Anyway, it might sound like I'm trying to talk myself out of some sales here, but I'm just trying to provide some general advice.
Author:  p2501 [ Tue Nov 06, 2012 12:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
gogameguru wrote:
Unfortunately, most of the really good problem collections still aren't available (or in print) in English, but Yellow Mountain has some books in Chinese and we're looking at setting up a special import service for some of the best problem books. If not by Christmas, we'll have this available early in 2013.

Wohooo!
Author:  NoSkill [ Tue Nov 06, 2012 4:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What to buy for christmas?
Thanks david, can you say any specific videos I should look at even if I don't know korean?

I bought the full trial for a week thing yesterday.

Also is there any chance in the future the english baduk TV will be able to be bought seperately or would this be kinda pointless?

Like just the english part.
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