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KataGo self-play games + video reviews http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=17217 |
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Author: | Maharani [ Sun Jan 14, 2024 9:22 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KataGo self-play games + video reviews |
xela, thank you so much for your comments!! And knotwilg too for your elaboration! xela wrote: Sorry I'm not able to keep up with the pace and review every game here. Oh, come on. You tell me this even though I took exactly a year's break between games 103 and 104...? Out of curiosity, what do you make of the bizarre "joseki" sequence from move 8 to 17? xela wrote: Thanks again for posting these fascinating games! Even I don't get time to post my comments every time, I'm enjoying the ones that I manage to look at. Please keep going with this Thank you so much, I will! I'm up to game 141 by now. The one-year break of posting here was just because of this forum's bug with uploading .sgfs. I've been waiting for ZBaduk to implement a new KataGo net before I continue. All the games since game 82 in July 2022 have been using the same 60b network, whose fuseki potential I think I've exhausted by now. |
Author: | Maharani [ Mon Jan 15, 2024 12:44 pm ] | ||
Post subject: | Re: My hand-crafted KataGo (+ AlphaGo Teach) self-play games | ||
Game 111 (7 komi, NZ rules) is a fighting game that results in a draw after only 224 moves. https://online-go.com/review/1017234 Tang Jie, CHN 5d has reviewed this game! I’ve included all of his (commented) variations, plus more KataGo variations, in the OGS review. .sgf:
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Author: | xela [ Mon Jan 15, 2024 3:05 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KataGo self-play games + video reviews |
Maharani wrote: xela wrote: Sorry I'm not able to keep up with the pace and review every game here. Oh, come on. You tell me this even though I took exactly a year's break between games 102 and 103...? :mrgreen: Yes, well, real life gets in the way of my go addiction sometimes... Maharani wrote: Out of curiosity, what do you make of the bizarre "joseki" sequence from move 8 to 17? Right, I didn't comment on that because:
Move 8 is new to me, but the shape gets about 30 hits in my GoGoD+go4go database. It's the sort of probe you'd expect once black has built a moyo, checking black's reaction before deciding whether to reduce or invade. And indeed in the database it generally happens between move 40 and 60, sometimes later and with other black stones in that quarter of the board. There were a couple of examples around move 22 or 23. But nothing as early as move 8! I guess here, white is probing before choosing the joseki sequence in the lower left. And the diagonal move at white 18 is a little unusual. But the part that's beyond my understanding is the relationship between the joseki and the top right. Trying some different sequences in KataGo:
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Author: | Maharani [ Mon Jan 15, 2024 8:19 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KataGo self-play games + video reviews |
Thank you, super fascinating!! As a side note, I haven't explored any AGT positions for two years (25 games with CHN rules and 7.5 komi). All of the 141 games played with NZ rules and 7 komi are native KataGo games. |
Author: | Maharani [ Tue Jan 16, 2024 1:16 pm ] | ||
Post subject: | Re: My hand-crafted KataGo (+ AlphaGo Teach) self-play games | ||
Game 112 (7 komi, NZ rules) sees white exploring some mysterious aji in black's bottom right corner. Move 93 is a signature KataGo move, with black beginning to make sabaki in white's sketched-out moyo. By move 154, white is firmly 2 points ahead, causing black to lose his will to live and lose by at least 12 points thirty moves later. https://online-go.com/review/1019740 .sgf:
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Author: | Maharani [ Wed Jan 17, 2024 1:02 am ] | ||
Post subject: | Re: My hand-crafted KataGo (+ AlphaGo Teach) self-play games | ||
In game 113 (7 komi, NZ rules), black amusingly keeps ignoring white's bit-by-bit reduction of his large left-side area in order to profit in the bottom left corner and center instead. The game ends as a draw. https://online-go.com/review/1024533 .sgf:
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Author: | Maharani [ Thu Jan 18, 2024 7:24 pm ] | ||
Post subject: | Re: My hand-crafted KataGo (+ AlphaGo Teach) self-play games | ||
In game 114 (7 komi, NZ rules), by move 88, black has built a giant top left moyo and white has built an equally giant center bottom moyo; then they invade and reduce each other in equal amounts. Move 78 is rather spectacular. The game is a draw. https://online-go.com/review/1027348 .sgf file:
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Author: | Maharani [ Thu Jan 18, 2024 10:21 pm ] | ||
Post subject: | Re: My hand-crafted KataGo (+ AlphaGo Teach) self-play games | ||
Game 115 (NZ rules, 7 komi) escalates into an all-consuming center fight after black deviates from the top left joseki to cut at D14. After move 216, black decides that, since he's at least 1 point behind, he might as well lose by 12 points. https://online-go.com/review/1032799 .sgf:
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Author: | RobertJasiek [ Thu Jan 18, 2024 11:44 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KataGo self-play games + video reviews |
I have studied these AI opening a lot but they need not result in a center fight. They can also start an early endgame. |
Author: | Maharani [ Fri Jan 19, 2024 12:55 am ] | ||
Post subject: | Re: My hand-crafted KataGo (+ AlphaGo Teach) self-play games | ||
In game 116 (7 komi, NZ rules), black gets four corners, lives in the middle, and loses by about 4 points: https://online-go.com/demo/view/1036390 Tang Jie, CHN 5d has reviewed this game! I’ve included all of his (commented) variations, plus more KataGo variations, in the OGS review. .sgf:
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Author: | Maharani [ Fri Jan 19, 2024 11:12 pm ] | ||
Post subject: | Re: My hand-crafted KataGo (+ AlphaGo Teach) self-play games | ||
In game 117 (7 komi, NZ rules), move 45 got a 0.05 % rating from the policy network. After a lot of fighting, by move 185, KataGo realizes that black is at least 2 points ahead. White loses her will to live, and the game by at least 72 points. https://online-go.com/review/1038752 GoDave89, EGF 4d has done a 60-minute video review of this game! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTHN84KO63c I’ve included all of his (commented) variations, plus more KataGo variations, in the OGS review as well. .sgf:
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Author: | Maharani [ Fri Jan 19, 2024 11:53 pm ] | ||
Post subject: | Re: My hand-crafted KataGo (+ AlphaGo Teach) self-play games | ||
Game 118 (7 komi, NZ rules), starting around move 43, turns into a whole-board fight. A ko starting at move 207 lasts for 50 moves. Black and white end up with four living groups each, and the game is a draw. https://online-go.com/review/1039984 .sgf:
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Author: | Maharani [ Sat Jan 20, 2024 3:01 pm ] | ||
Post subject: | Re: My hand-crafted KataGo (+ AlphaGo Teach) self-play games | ||
In game 119 (7 komi, NZ rules), after a complicated fight on the bottom settles by move 98, another huge fight starts on the left at move 99. Once all the dust settles, the game ends as a draw. https://online-go.com/review/1045306 Tang Jie, CHN 5d has done a 45-minute video review of this game! https://drive.google.com/file/d/1GDlkmT ... vAstB/view I’ve included all of his (commented) variations, plus more KataGo variations, in the OGS review. .sgf:
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Author: | Maharani [ Tue Jan 23, 2024 10:14 am ] | ||
Post subject: | Re: My hand-crafted KataGo (+ AlphaGo Teach) self-play games | ||
In game 120 (7 komi, NZ rules), by move 92, black and white have cooperated to build a fence in the middle of the board, and they stay true to this arrangement. Black ends up sacrificing 28 stones on the left side of the board while white sacrifices 12 stones on the right side. In the end, four territories remain on the board; one is worth 15 points, one is worth 49 points, one is worth 64 points, and one is worth 91 points. A very satisfying draw. https://online-go.com/review/1049006 .sgf:
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Author: | Maharani [ Fri Jan 26, 2024 12:53 pm ] | ||
Post subject: | Re: My hand-crafted KataGo (+ AlphaGo Teach) self-play games | ||
In game 121 (7 komi, NZ rules), white tenukiing the bottom right joseki to grab a quick corner at move 8 leads to an early complicated fight. The game ends as a draw. https://online-go.com/review/1054267 Tang Jie, CHN 5d has reviewed this game! I’ve included all of his (commented) variations, plus more KataGo variations, in the OGS review. .sgf:
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Author: | Maharani [ Fri Jan 26, 2024 1:52 pm ] | ||
Post subject: | Re: My hand-crafted KataGo (+ AlphaGo Teach) self-play games | ||
Game 122 (7 komi, NZ rules) is a mindbendingly insane game of which Eunkyo Do (KOR 1p) said: "It looks like they are playing another game than go!" It ends as a draw. https://online-go.com/review/1059280 Tang Jie, CHN 5d has done a 55-minute video review of this game! https://drive.google.com/file/d/1G8DrNB ... sp=sharing I’ve included all of his (commented) variations, plus more KataGo variations, in the OGS review. .sgf:
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Author: | Maharani [ Fri Jan 26, 2024 10:59 pm ] | ||
Post subject: | Re: My hand-crafted KataGo (+ AlphaGo Teach) self-play games | ||
Game 123 (7 komi, NZ rules) is a game of strange shapes. Tough for my 10k brain to summarize what's going on. After move 232, black realizes he's firmly behind by 2 points, and resigns six moves later. https://online-go.com/review/1061025 .sgf:
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Author: | Maharani [ Sat Jan 27, 2024 12:28 pm ] | ||
Post subject: | Re: My hand-crafted KataGo (+ AlphaGo Teach) self-play games | ||
Game 124 (NZ rules, 7 komi) is a game with four 3-3 invasions. Black connects up two of his 3-3 invasions to make a 38-point territory on the left side, whereas white uses her top right 3-3 invasion to capture black's invaded corner. The game ends as a draw. https://online-go.com/review/1063933 .sgf:
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Author: | Maharani [ Sat Jan 27, 2024 1:14 pm ] | ||
Post subject: | Re: My hand-crafted KataGo (+ AlphaGo Teach) self-play games | ||
What I enjoy most about game 125 (7 komi, NZ rules) is black and white breezily floating around the bottom side. After move 184, black realizes he's firmly behind by at least 2 points, so he starts wasting ko threats. https://online-go.com/review/1069204 .sgf:
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