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The future of KGS
http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=11044		 Page 1 of 3
Author:  Hong Ny [ Sun Nov 09, 2014 4:05 am ]
Post subject:  The future of KGS
So, I was wondering lately: Where will KGS be in ten years from now?

I don't have an opinion about this, but I am all ears to hear yours.
Author:  schawipp [ Sun Nov 09, 2014 5:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
I still think that amongst all clients the KGS interface offers most what you always would like to have in a good casual club atmosphere:
  • It allows chatting even after the game is over and shows, who else is observing the game
  • It has a very nice review feature
  • It is beginner friendly
However, according to some issues with Java updates etc. it seems that some people left the server and looked elsewhere. In fact, nowadays it can take quite some time to get a game on KGS. One further issue might be that it is very easy to access all online playing statistics from all players, even if you have not registered there. This might increase online go playing anxiety as all game records are immediately publicly exposed.

Other servers have its bugs and pitfalls, too:

  • IGS seems to have the most polished interface. However some things are strange: (i) When a game is over the chat window is immediately inactive and you have to look up the player in the players list to continue the chat (or did I miss something). That makes the feeling a bit impersonal. (ii) There is a review feature but it is not straight-forward to activate it just after a game is finished; (iii) You have to pass three times until counting starts. During counting, one of the clocks still seems to run (at least in the observer's window).
  • I like WBaduk because of the playing style there. However only the Windows client seems to run more or less stable (at least after you found the option to deactivate all flash animations). The android client seems to work, but it seems to not record the win/loss statistics and rating points after playing (that's at least what I experienced). It is also not very beginner friendly since its DDK players have at least the same average strength as strong SDK players on KGS (I seem almost ten stones weaker there than on KGS and I'm not intentionally sandbagging...). It is also a bit tricky to obtain the games as SGF afterwards and there is no review feature.
  • Tygem looks nice. However expect for the windows client, it requires you to recognize Korean characters to use the interface.

Therefore I think KGS still has its place (I haven't tried OGS yet, though...) and I would miss it if it should close. All above IMHO of course...
Author:  xed_over [ Sun Nov 09, 2014 9:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
the java issues have been fixed now
Author:  Abyssinica [ Sun Nov 09, 2014 10:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
The exact same.
Author:  xed_over [ Sun Nov 09, 2014 11:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
apparently, in order to fix some things, he had to break other things.
https://plus.google.com/u/1/+Gokgs/posts/YHerseV86gM
Author:  hyperpape [ Sun Nov 09, 2014 2:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
I suspect that within 10 years, wms will have finished an html/browser based version.
Author:  snorri [ Sun Nov 09, 2014 3:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
In 10 years, we will all be replaced by AIs. However, KGS will still be around and the robots will still complain about the escaper policy.
Author:  RBerenguel [ Sun Nov 09, 2014 4:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
hyperpape wrote:
I suspect that within 10 years, wms will have finished an html/browser based version.


HTML9 compatible I hope
Author:  DrStraw [ Sun Nov 09, 2014 4:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
KGS has been around for 14 years. It has seen many improvements, although not so many recently. Why assume there will be much change in this pattern. Bill is providing a service for free, when and if he is available from his requirements to provide for his family. I think that if KGS continues to exists with minor improvements then everyone should be happy.
Author:  Pippen [ Sun Nov 09, 2014 7:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
Someone (Tygem, WBaduk, IGS, ...) should just "copy" the CGoban- & KGS-structure. It's that good, it's that intuitive. WMS doesn't need to improve a thing, KGS is complete (maybe the simpler rating system of Tygem would be more motivating and fun-making, but so what).

My problem is this: If WMS did such a good job with KGS in such a limited time then what could he do if he'd put even more time & dedication in it?
Author:  Bonobo [ Sun Nov 09, 2014 7:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
RBerenguel wrote:
HTML9 compatible I hope

Reddit/“Where do you imagine KGS to be in ten years from now?” says it will be HTML12 by then :cool:
Author:  Bantari [ Mon Nov 10, 2014 7:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
Pippen wrote:
My problem is this: If WMS did such a good job with KGS in such a limited time then what could he do if he'd put even more time & dedication in it?

Not sure why is that a "problem".

If you mean it as question, then I guess the answer is this:
WMS put as much time into KGS as he had available to put into KGS, no more,a no no less. If he put in more time, KGS would have been better. The same goes for almost everything anybody ever does. Unless somebody creates perfection.
Author:  RBerenguel [ Mon Nov 10, 2014 10:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
Bonobo wrote:
RBerenguel wrote:
HTML9 compatible I hope

Reddit/“Where do you imagine KGS to be in ten years from now?” says it will be HTML12 by then :cool:


Unlikely. Even 9 is a stretch of imagination, I liked 9 as a number for the hyperbole. As far as "stable" versions went, HTML 2 is from 1995, 3.2 from 1997, 4.01 1999, 5 2014. That's 2 years, 2 years, 15 years. In 10 years we'd either get not further than HTML 9 (or some minor 8.something) or just HTML6.
Author:  Uberdude [ Mon Nov 10, 2014 10:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
Unless W3C copies Firefox's style and we have HTML562 ;-)
Author:  RBerenguel [ Mon Nov 10, 2014 10:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
Uberdude wrote:
Unless W3C copies Firefox's style and we have HTML562 ;-)


Yeah, or they follow Microsoft's numbering with the Xbox. We'll essentially have HTML rand(496)+5 kind of
Author:  oren [ Mon Nov 10, 2014 1:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
I was thinking we would have iHTML jaguar or something silly.
Author:  DalekSnare [ Mon Nov 10, 2014 5:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
I'd like to see the HTML 5 version working in every browser and also an app for all platforms. Java used to be the best for cross platform when it was just computers. Nowadays it's very limiting since all the new devices don't run java programs. The Android app is a start, but that doesn't help you if you have an iPad or Windows phone. The surface pro can run the old java client, but a more tablet-friendly app version would be nice.
Author:  RBerenguel [ Tue Nov 11, 2014 1:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
DalekSnare wrote:
I'd like to see the HTML 5 version working in every browser and also an app for all platforms. Java used to be the best for cross platform when it was just computers. Nowadays it's very limiting since all the new devices don't run java programs. The Android app is a start, but that doesn't help you if you have an iPad or Windows phone. The surface pro can run the old java client, but a more tablet-friendly app version would be nice.


Java client-side is dying, even without considering tablets/phones. I think currently I'm using semi-regularly just 3 things java-related: Gephi, KGS and GoWrite. Well, and some text-mining library I've used in R, depended on some piece of the Apache project written in Java, can't remember the name. Of course a datapoint serves nothing, but killing most Java-as-applet is effectively reducing Java in desktops at a similar rate.
Author:  karaklis [ Wed Nov 12, 2014 12:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
xed_over wrote:
the java issues have been fixed now

I have heard this several times now, but I still have no sound (Windows 8.1, Java Version 8, Update 25 (Build 1.8.0_25-b18)
Author:  Mef [ Wed Nov 12, 2014 4:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: The future of KGS
karaklis wrote:
xed_over wrote:
the java issues have been fixed now

I have heard this several times now, but I still have no sound (Windows 8.1, Java Version 8, Update 25 (Build 1.8.0_25-b18)


Just to verify -- What version of CGoban3 are you currently running (this appears in the lower left corner of the application start screen)? Also verify that the "Sound enabled" box is checked under the configure menu (I've heard from some that it was unchecked after they upgraded), also make sure the combo box below it isn't set for "No games".
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