How about the Grumpy Old LGBT room. We're not all young and happy.
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| KGS homophobia? http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=1486 |
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| Author: | gaius [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 3:24 am ] |
| Post subject: | KGS homophobia? |
OK. So I like KGS. But I recently heard about something quite off-putting. Apparently, the admins barred the LGBT room from being public (it must be password-protected); also, it cannot even be called that way, it has to have a silly name like "Rainbow Friends". Right now, the room seems to have died because of too few games played. Yet, I wonder who felt the need for this strange policy, when virtually any other random social room is allowed... |
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| Author: | kirkmc [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 3:50 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
Hmm, just wondering, are there social rooms for blacks, anti-abortion supporters, or members of any religious group? Why does there need to be an "LGBT" room? Do these players need to be segregated? |
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| Author: | topazg [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 3:53 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
I am a member of Rainbow Friends and I have a vague recollection of this, I think it was due to not creating a group that people would just flame for the sake of it. I agree I am not entirely happy with the precedent it sets, I don't think it was admin homophobia. There have been some interesting episodes with the creator of the group also, but most of those seem resolved. |
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| Author: | amnal [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 6:22 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
Whose idea was it to call it 'rainbow friends'? Edit: Also, being in a room =/= segregated from other rooms. |
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| Author: | kirkmc [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 6:32 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
amnal wrote: Edit: Also, being in a room =/= segregated from other rooms. It is, actually; it's self-segregation. Do you think there should be a black room? Not only is that segregation, but it suggests that others aren't wanted. We're talking about go here; that there are rooms by language makes sense, but sexual preference? Should there therefore be rooms for every group that claims its difference? |
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| Author: | Stable [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 6:40 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
kirkmc wrote: Should there therefore be rooms for every group that claims its difference? Yes, if they want one. |
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| Author: | CarlJung [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 6:43 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
Sweet, who's starting the Grumpy Old Men room? Oh nevermind, we already have the gd/L19 room. |
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| Author: | deja [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 7:15 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
How about the Grumpy Old LGBT room. We're not all young and happy.
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| Author: | amnal [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 7:28 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
kirkmc wrote: amnal wrote: Edit: Also, being in a room =/= segregated from other rooms. It is, actually; it's self-segregation. Do you think there should be a black room? Not only is that segregation, but it suggests that others aren't wanted. We're talking about go here; that there are rooms by language makes sense, but sexual preference? Should there therefore be rooms for every group that claims its difference? I suppose maybe it is technically segregation, but not in the way that I considered meaningful (unless the members ignore all the other rooms). Given which, it's equally as damaging as the segregation arising from (say) the godiscussions/l19 rooms. Which don't seem problematic to me. If people want to talk about stuff, they're welcome to. Sometimes if a significant number of them want to talk about the same thing, they might be told to join a different room and stop spamming (Which is why the English chat room and English game room are separate). If the different things to talk about centre around LGBT identity, having an LGBT room seems like a logical progression. I'd consider this sequence reasonable regardless of subject matter, the fact that it's LGBT doesn't seem important. I wouldn't have read that 'others aren't wanted' any more than I'd read that those who don't want to chat may not enter the English chat room. I could be wrong, of course, maybe they would chase away the non-LGBT. EDIT: But I still want to know who chose 'Rainbow Friends'  EDIT2: And yes, I don't care if people want to start a room called the black room, assuming people want to and that it is an entirely optional part of KGS (as any other room is). I don't think there *should* be one, but I don't care if someone wants to make one. |
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| Author: | mdobbins [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 8:25 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
kirkmc wrote: ... Do you think there should be a black room? Yes, for all the players who only want to play black!! 
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| Author: | mdobbins [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 8:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
amnal wrote: ... But I still want to know who chose 'Rainbow Friends' Does that have anything to do with playing with the green stones?
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| Author: | wms [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 10:05 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
H'mmm, I would need to know more about what happened I think. I certainly hope there is no homophobia going on there, but until you know the whole story it's impossible to say. I do remember clearly when we had somebody complain about a user with name that made reference to him being gay and also to sex (can't remember the exact name any more). When I asked the guy to change his name, he called me a homophobe, until I pointed out that I had also asked "sexGoddess" (or some such) to change her name a few weeks earlier. Anyway, that seemed to calm him down - he was mad when he thought I was a homophobe, but I guess he didn't mind when he found out I was just a prude. 
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| Author: | Javaness [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 11:07 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
gaius wrote: OK. So I like KGS. But I recently heard about something quite off-putting. Apparently, the admins barred the LGBT room from being public (it must be password-protected); also, it cannot even be called that way, it has to have a silly name like "Rainbow Friends". Right now, the room seems to have died because of too few games played. Yet, I wonder who felt the need for this strange policy, when virtually any other random social room is allowed... The reasoning for making it private was so that it couldn't be accessed by trouble making Homer-phobes, thus allowing the room without creating inevitable tedious work for admins. I, as an admin, ban users for homophobic remarks. Homophobia, like other types of abuse, is not tolerated on the server. It was purely a practical decision. A while ago a user hijacked the room and locked everyone out of it, which probably contributed to the lack of games being played in it. |
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| Author: | daal [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 2:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
hanekomu wrote: kirkmc wrote: ... it's self-segregation. Do you think there should be a black room? Not only is that segregation, but it suggests that others aren't wanted. I don't follow the logic. I sometimes go into the German room, though I'm not German, or to the Japanese room, though I'm not Japanese. And you wouldn't be barred from going to a gay restaurant or bar either. Rooms have particular themes so that people can get together with others who share that common interest. If you don't share that interest, you may not be banned, but you also might not be welcomed with open arms. Experiment: go into the French room and write something in English. See how long it takes till the word "Anglais" appears; that'll be someone complaining about your post. |
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| Author: | gaius [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 2:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
Javaness wrote: The reasoning for making it private was so that it couldn't be accessed by trouble making Homer-phobes, thus allowing the room without creating inevitable tedious work for admins. I, as an admin, ban users for homophobic remarks. Homophobia, like other types of abuse, is not tolerated on the server. It was purely a practical decision. A while ago a user hijacked the room and locked everyone out of it, which probably contributed to the lack of games being played in it. That might make sense if there are too many problems there. My interest was sparked during a recent conversation in a bar with a lot of alcohol, so I missed out on a lot of the background story... Such a shame that it's necessary though. |
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| Author: | Javaness [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 2:58 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
gaius wrote: That might make sense if there are too many problems there. My interest was sparked during a recent conversation in a bar with a lot of alcohol, so I missed out on a lot of the background story... Such a shame that it's necessary though. It would be nice if it was not necessary |
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| Author: | deja [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 3:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
What's disheartening is the targeted harassment of this room to the point of effectively shutting it down. My impulse in such circumstances is to stand up to these bullies and make it clear that intimidation and disruption doesn't work. Yes, it's a pain in the ass [really? the word a$$ is censored?] to maintain a presence under these circumstances but sometimes doing the right thing is not pleasant or convenient but necessary. The nice thing about KGS rooms is that you're not required to join them. If a particular room bothers you for whatever reason, move on the next one. If you can't live with the fact that others are different from you, try your luck with another server – you won't be missed. |
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| Author: | Javaness [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 3:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
what targetted harassment...? |
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| Author: | deja [ Thu Aug 26, 2010 4:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
Javaness wrote: what targetted harassment...? Javaness wrote: A while ago a user hijacked the room and locked everyone out of it, which probably contributed to the lack of games being played in it.
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| Author: | cgbspender [ Wed Sep 01, 2010 9:46 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: KGS homophobia? |
I, as the owner of the late Rainbow Room, will clarify some points. The Rainbow Room was indeed private, but not to segregate ourselves, like you seem to think, but for the reasons below. Here are the points I want to explain. 1) Prevent kids from entering as well as the homophobiacs so that we can discuss freely (Note : the room was not attended exclusively by gay players, also open-minded players could join, and many of them did join) 2) Even though it's true that we kinda had a hard time to create the room, please don't put the blame on KGS administration. As a matter of fact, some of the admins supported us in spite of the tollé it had provoked at that time. 3) Talking about segregation is offending. Please taste what it takes to be gay once. Get laughed at, assaulted or insulted, or whatever, and then we will see how you guys react. From my point of view, locking the door of the room was just self-protection. -- Matthieu aka Cgbspender. |
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