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Offline dfan
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #23 - dfan vs Loons
Post #41 Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 4:26 pm 
Gosei

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Safe for Loons
As soon as I made that move I realized that I didn't even consider this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Move 22
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . W . O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]

which feels a lot nicer, although maybe I'd change my mind if I actually played out some variations. Regardless, I should have at least looked at it.


Last edited by dfan on Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline Loons
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #23 - dfan vs Loons
Post #42 Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 5:45 pm 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 1378
Location: wHam!lton, Aotearoa
Liked others: 253
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Thinking...
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 23-
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . B . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]

Ok, I see 2-3 continuations from here
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 23-
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . 2 . . O O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X 1 . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]
>Protects cutting point
>Solid
>Kinda slow feeling but may allow for a jump
>White is looking very alive

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 23-
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . 1 . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]
>I try and do some magic
>He plays the (good)ladder breaker and I will get another local move, may be able to keep the group light
>Feels fast

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 23-
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]
>Allows cut to try and cheat white out of eyespace on the top edge
>Black will find dealing with the cut awkward

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 23-
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X 1 . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . 2 . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]
>Emphasises top right corner
>Doesn't protect cut but may help
>Hang on 2 doesn't look good for black

I am getting good feelings from my second diagram. He will have trouble from it either on top or on the right side. Alright, I'm doing it. Sorry about my lack of reading depth, I'll try and put more work into it in future moves.

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Offline dfan
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #23 - dfan vs Loons
Post #43 Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 6:03 pm 
Gosei

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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Move 24
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]

I think I have to get this in before Black does. N18 for him would basically be sente and finish off a nice wall. Plus he can't double hane here. After

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X 2 . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]

my main decision will be whether to go back to making a base as originally planned, or do something crazy like

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . a . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O 3 4 b . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X X . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]

figuring that my group can handle itself. (Maybe not; a looks kind of annoying. Another reason I should have considered playing the tiger's mouth last move.)

Another thing to keep in mind about the 1-2 exchange is that I may be able to pull off some nonsense later with b.
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Offline Loons
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #23 - dfan vs Loons
Post #44 Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 8:47 pm 
Gosei
User avatar

Posts: 1378
Location: wHam!lton, Aotearoa
Liked others: 253
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 25-
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . B O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]

Alright, I was thinking about him doing this last move, and my conceptual goal here is to make his move seem small. The two moves that leap out at me here are...

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 25-
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . b X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , a . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]
a; I've been wanting to stop him extending forever, and it looks like I'm starting to develop some strength over there myself... Low probably to minimize the effect of him coming out from the shimari at it. I'd like to get a swing or two in at his shimari after the right side starts getting settled, so I might have an eye to that. I want to try and use the fact that he's walking towards my 4-4 stone from outside to stop him actually jumping in, though, and I can maybe play some sente moves to that effect. The turn at B also feels huge for black (and I guess white, considering how lifey he's got), but I might be able to hane or double hane in that direction anyway after takes it, with an eye to my possible extension on the right.

Putting some of these ideas together, I might try and tesuji out a special move.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 25-
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O 1 3 . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X 2 . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X 4 . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . X 5 . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]
Hmm, looks vaguely horrible gote for black... Gonna think some more, will keep you posted.

Alright I haven't pressed post yet, but trying again on a similar theme, I think I've found something.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 25-
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . e . a . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . c d 1 O b 4 . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X 2 . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X 3 . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , 5 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]
Tryin' to get my brain in gear for this... Actually, the hangingish connection is a mistake and allows for a ko to cut... Along the letters. Assuming he solidly connects though, he doesn't get that trumpet shape as he up/towards my corner, which I think slows him a bit. And even so 1 has some aji. Alright, I'm going for it. Here's to moves I'll regret tomorrow.

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Offline fwiffo
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #23 - dfan vs Loons
Post #45 Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 9:32 pm 
Gosei
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Reading one move further, there is no kind of ko.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ ----------------------+
$$ . . 5 . 1 6 . . . . . |
$$ . 3 4 X O 2 O . . . . |
$$ . . O O X O . . . . . |
$$ . , O X X . . X . . . |
$$ . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

And this looks like a problem.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O . O . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X X 1 4 X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . X . 2 3 a . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . b 5 . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

I can't read all the variations (maybe a or b is better than :w5:), but this looks very hazardous for black.

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Offline dfan
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #23 - dfan vs Loons
Post #46 Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2010 8:15 am 
Gosei

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KGS: dfan
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Move 26
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X W . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]

What, really? Does his cut work? Am I missing something? Black's last move looks like a big mistake. Maybe he is trying to set up some sort of squeeze but I just don't see it.

It was actually a tough choice between this and extending, which should be seriously sente because of this squeeze:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ -----------------------+
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . 2 X O 1 . . . . . |
$$ . . O O X 4 5 . . . . |
$$ . , O X 3 6 7 X . . . |
$$ . . . X . 8 . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

but after this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ -----------------------+
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . X O 1 3 a . . . |
$$ . . O O X 2 4 . . . . |
$$ . , O X . . . X . . . |
$$ . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

I didn't like that I either have to keep extending (without sente anymore) or let Black completely block me at a.

This nice thing here:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ -----------------------+
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . X O . 3 . . . . |
$$ . . O O X 1 . . b . . |
$$ . , O X 2 . . X . . . |
$$ . . . X . . a . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

is that I am threatening to cut at a, not to mention take the entire corner with b.

I don't think he can pull any nonsense like this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ -----------------------+
$$ . . 6 . 4 . . . . . . |
$$ . . . X O 5 3 . . . . |
$$ . . O O X 1 . . . . . |
$$ . , O X 2 . . X . . . |
$$ . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

aiming for a ko or something. I can cut him off and he should die before anything bad happens.
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Offline unkx80
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #23 - dfan vs Loons
Post #47 Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2010 11:56 am 
Lives with ko

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In the position below, black's only correct move is to connect at :b1:. Allowing white to hane at a is too big because it helps white settle its upper side.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . a . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X 1 . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]


In the diagram below, :b1: is simply a thank-you move. Black gets nothing at all.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 1 O . 4 . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X 2 . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X 3 . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]

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Offline Loons
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #23 - dfan vs Loons
Post #48 Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2010 3:19 pm 
Gosei
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Move 27
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X B . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]

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Offline dfan
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #23 - dfan vs Loons
Post #49 Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2010 3:26 pm 
Gosei

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KGS: dfan
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Move 28
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O . W . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]

As planned.
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Offline Loons
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #23 - dfan vs Loons
Post #50 Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2010 3:56 pm 
Gosei
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Move 29
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . B . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O . O . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]

Argh... We're rapidly moving in a W+R direction... Somehow, despite the long terms for moves, I failed to play calmly or rationally... This KO won't even yield a good result for me...

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Offline fwiffo
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #23 - dfan vs Loons
Post #51 Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2010 5:07 pm 
Gosei
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Take a long hard look at your sig, then a long hard look at the board. There's no ko! :sad:

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Offline dfan
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #23 - dfan vs Loons
Post #52 Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:11 pm 
Gosei

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KGS: dfan
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Move 30
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . X O W O . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ +---------------------------------------+[/go]

I still don't see that he has anything. He can only be trying to start a ko, but I have enough liberties, and he has to crawl so far before he can try to connect up, that I don't see any way it can work. I'll have egg on my face if I'm wrong...

Here's an example in which I can at least can get the tail (if Black a then White b). I bet I can do better if it comes to it, but it's nice to know that this is a worst case.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ +---------------------------------------+
$$ | . . . . . . . . 6 4 2 a X 7 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . b . 3 5 X O 1 O . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . O O X O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , O X X . . X . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]
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Offline Loons
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #23 - dfan vs Loons
Post #53 Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:53 pm 
Gosei
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Ack, I resign.

Somehow, the "thinking" part of my brain seems to not have been in charge for a few moves now.

Thankyou kindly for the game, Dfan! We must certainly play again some time.

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Offline Clossius
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #23 - dfan vs Loons
Post #54 Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2010 8:10 pm 
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Why resign so early? Sure you lost a few points and your behind now, but is it really game over already?

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Offline dfan
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #23 - dfan vs Loons
Post #55 Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2010 8:17 pm 
Gosei

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Thanks for the game, Loons.

Playing slow games like this is really different from playing live. It's good for your go to really spend time reading things out. You might want to try playing some games on DGS or OGS.

That said, I think your biggest mistake was... resigning too early! Yes, it's a bad local result, but how many points can I really possibly be leading by? I'm only 3 or 4 kyu - trust me, I would have made some mistakes later :)
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Offline Loons
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #23 - dfan vs Loons
Post #56 Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2010 8:42 pm 
Gosei
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Hmm, I have realized that I might be coming across as a poor sport! (Bad local result?!? : Resign)

That was not my intention (though I guess it is sort of (exactly)what just happened) - I think that after this exchange you are ahead, and I want to focus on doing some Tsumego and my learning game with Magicwand for the next while.

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Offline Dusk Eagle
 Post subject: Re: Malkovich #23 - dfan vs Loons
Post #57 Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2010 9:06 pm 
Gosei
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Yes, black definitely was not out of the game yet. Sure, at the end of the game, this sequence might be called "the losing moves", but only if you happen to lose ;-) . There's still plenty of time to play large-scale moves and try to claw your way back.

Though I do understand from personal experience on KGS: sometimes when you've played a bad sequence you're so upset with yourself that you feel like resigning on the spot and just forgetting your blunder.

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Board index » L19²GO (Malkovich) » 1-on-1 Malkovich games

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