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Offline fwiffo
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #101 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 7:47 am 
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If you can be bullied in the middle-game, all it can mean is that your middle-game fighting skills are weak. It's that simple.

Bullies exist at all levels. When I was 5-6 kyu, I would get bullied by a certain kind of player who had no opening theory at all and would play all kinds of unreasonable cuts and attachments and invasions to start crazy contact fights as soon as possible (and they would play fast to try to intimidate.) I'm a very by-the-book type of player, and I knew the moves were unreasonable. Uncivilized barbarians! But I couldn't really punish them because my reading just wasn't good enough. It was frustrating to "win" the opening (where I'm strongest) and then get clobbered in the middle-game, because I couldn't punish overplays (even though my middle-game skills were pretty decent against non-bullies.)

So I am very familiar with that sense of frustration, and I'm glad to know it exists in players that are stronger than me. :mrgreen:

But eventually my reading got better, and my sense of connection and cutting got better, and now those are the kinds of players I beat. Now the players that beat me do so because they have a better sense of shape, or direction of play. Or they do out-read me, but I don't get bullied by overplays. And when I do run into a bully, they don't seem strong anymore, they seem desperate. And they seem end up with lots of dead stones.

I'd say magicwand needs to play against some of our high-dans. It seems like he's played a lot of Malkovich games against low-dan players and kyus. Either he'll get punished for overplays, or he'll prove they're not overplays, or we'll see a different style of go from him. However it goes, it'll be interesting.

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Offline Bill Spight
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #102 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 7:55 am 
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zinger wrote:
Interesting. I have also met players like you describe - I think most of us have. But I am happy to have them around! Playing with them toughens up my fighting which is just what I need. If I don't get an objective post-mortem, I can live with that.

Maybe it is like swimming. You can study swimming all you want, know how to tell good strokes from bad, recite proper breathing technique, etc. But you can't really swim until you get in the pool. I think Magicwand has spent more time in the pool than most of us.


I am reminded of getting my Lifesaving merit badge in Boy Scouts. The final test was to "rescue" one of the instructors. The thing is, once you reached the "drowning" man, he tried to drown you! ;) (People afraid of drowning will often try to climb on top of a rescuer, but this was much worse.)

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Offline Kirby
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #103 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 8:00 am 
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Hmm, a lot of comments. I wonder if this means that the optimism I mentioned earlier is unwarranted... I guess we'll find out soon. I wonder how Magicwand will respond...

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Offline Bill Spight
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #104 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 8:04 am 
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Kirby wrote:
I am feeling a bit better about this game, now. I'm not sure if my plans will work, but I have some optimism...


Hmmm. Just when I was getting worried. ;)

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Offline Bill Spight
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #105 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 8:10 am 
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Magicwand wrote:
what i played is usually bad...but i dont want him to giveup two stones on the side.


Kirby wrote:
I need to escape with my stones.


I think that this contrast is instructive. :)

I also think that this fight will reveal the power of White's central thickness. We have already seen its value, simply as a ladder breaker.

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Offline Kirby
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #106 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 8:27 am 
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I presume all of these are after game comments...

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Offline fwiffo
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #107 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 8:43 am 
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Bill Spight wrote:
I think that this contrast is instructive. :)

I also think that this fight will reveal the power of White's central thickness. We have already seen its value, simply as a ladder breaker.

I don't think all these comments and hidden discussion are helping Kirby's emotional state at all!

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Offline Kirby
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #108 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 9:29 am 
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Well, while I'm waiting for Magicwand to move, for those interested, I'll share what I'm thinking.

First of all, I think that my white stones on the side will be fine. Here are some possibilities:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 5 . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 X 1 . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . O 3 . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . . 6 . . X . . . . . . . X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I'm going to try to kill him.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . a . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 X . b . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . O 1 . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . 3 . . . . . . . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Then a or b to attack his stones. I'm going to try to use my influence on the bottom.

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Offline Magicwand
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #109 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 10:06 am 
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wow..so many hidden comments....
now i am really curious...

edit:
i am mostly curious about what bill said under the hidden.
he always gives me correct advice. earned my respect.

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Last edited by Magicwand on Thu May 06, 2010 10:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline Magicwand
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #110 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 10:08 am 
Tengen
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KGS: magicwand
Tygem: magicwand
Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm45 Move 45 - Prisoners: B=0, W=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , X . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . O W . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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Offline Kirby
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #111 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 10:21 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm47 Move 47 - Prisoners: B=0, W=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . B X . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . O O . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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Offline Kirby
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #112 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 10:37 am 
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I forgot about E12... It might be good for white... I'm thinking about how to answer that.

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Offline Magicwand
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #113 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 10:43 am 
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KGS: magicwand
Tygem: magicwand
Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm48 Move 48 - Prisoners: B=0, W=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X . W . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . O O . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

i think i am playing like water, avoiding obsticles not fight it.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm48 Move 48 - Prisoners: B=0, W=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . 2 . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X . W . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . O O . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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Offline Kirby
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #114 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 10:59 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm49 Move 49 - Prisoners: B=0, W=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X . O . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . O O . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . . B . . X . . . . . . . X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Let's rumble.

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Offline Magicwand
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #115 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 11:03 am 
Tengen
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Posts: 4844
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KGS: magicwand
Tygem: magicwand
Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm50 Move 50 - Prisoners: B=0, W=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X . O . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . O O . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . . X W . X . . . . . . . X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

added comment
something i didnt really worry about. but now it seems pretty sharp.
i might live by playing at "a" but i probably get better result my killing all my group.
i want to see what his next move is first. then i will make a decision. i think i will be ok but..it's only an intuation and dont see anything definite yet.
i am still confident that i will win this game easily.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm50 Move 50 - Prisoners: B=0, W=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X . O . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . O O . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . a O . . . . . X . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . . X W . X . . . . . . . X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

_________________
"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"
Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson


Last edited by Magicwand on Thu May 06, 2010 11:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline Kirby
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #116 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 11:07 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm51 Move 51 - Prisoners: B=0, W=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X . O . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . O O . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . . X O . X . . . . . . . X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . B . . . . . . . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


There's a bit of danger at "a", but I'm going to figure out how to handle it (hopefully).
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm51
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X . O . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . O O . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . a . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . . X O . X . . . . . . . X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . B . . . . . . . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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Offline Magicwand
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #117 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 11:13 am 
Tengen
User avatar

Posts: 4844
Location: Mechanicsburg, PA
Liked others: 62
Was liked: 505
Rank: Wbaduk 7D
KGS: magicwand
Tygem: magicwand
Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm52 Move 52 - Prisoners: B=0, W=0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . X . O . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . X O O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . O O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X . O . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . X . O O . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . W . . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . . X O . X . . . . . . . X . X O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . O . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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The greater the unknown"
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Offline Magicwand
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #118 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 11:27 am 
Tengen
User avatar

Posts: 4844
Location: Mechanicsburg, PA
Liked others: 62
Was liked: 505
Rank: Wbaduk 7D
KGS: magicwand
Tygem: magicwand
Wbaduk: rlatkfkd
DGS: magicwand
OGS: magicwand
for the players only
and not for the Observers!!!
two can play that game!

Kerby! you can open this :)
first i would like you to know i am enjoying this game verymuch.
i hope you play you best game and enjoy also.

major goal of this hidden comment is to make the observers curious. :lol: :lol:

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"The more we think we know about
The greater the unknown"
Words by neil peart, music by geddy lee and alex lifeson
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Offline Kirby
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #119 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 11:57 am 
Honinbo

Posts: 9552
Liked others: 1602
Was liked: 1712
KGS: Kirby
Tygem: 커비라고해
For Magicwand only:

I am having fun, too. You play some very tricky moves. I am glad that I am making the game interesting for you. I was worried it was too easy and boring for you :)

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Offline Bill Spight
 Post subject: Re: 32. Magicwand vs. Kirby
Post #120 Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 12:14 pm 
Honinbo

Posts: 10905
Liked others: 3651
Was liked: 3374
:mrgreen:

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At some point, doesn't thinking have to go on?
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