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 Post subject: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #1 Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 1:42 pm 
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Universal go server handle: hailthorn
This game will be played using Japanese scoring with 6.5 komi.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Nigri:
4

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Last edited by hailthorn011 on Thu Jan 03, 2013 5:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods
Post #2 Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 3:28 pm 
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I guessed odd, so you take black. Have a good game!

(Mod-shaped people: I think this is #202.)

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #3 Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 5:55 pm 
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Whoops, sorry for forgetting the game number! Good game Billywoods!


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This game should be good for a few laughs with the audience considering this is my first serious game in quite a long time. If I blunder, well, it's because I suck. If I do something well, it's probably dumb luck. But it will probably be more the former than the latter. My goal here is to get back in the curve, and there's no better way to do that than getting your butt handed to you on a silver platter!

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This post by hailthorn011 was liked by: Bonobo
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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #4 Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 6:07 pm 
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By the way (for the observers): this game is open book, which hopefully means we'll both learn something...

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #5 Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 6:26 pm 
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Universal go server handle: hailthorn
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
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$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


That's right. I plan on going with the Sanrensei. Why not? I've had success with it in the past. I've also had massive failures with it in the past, but I like to play this opening. So assuming that Billywoods doesn't do something entirely unexpected, this will be my next move.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . M M . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . M M . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . B . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #6 Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:31 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


All rather boring so far. I'm envisioning an approach on my hoshi stone or a sanrensei. White could perhaps try to split, but I don't mind that at all. I typically find games with small groups and fighting fun, and moyo-based games rather annoying, so if he responds with sanrensei, I will have to go and find a way to break it up or respond with something Chinesey on the left and overcome my fear of moyo games. I especially hate being white in a moyo game - I always feel behind, and komi doesn't feel big enough.

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #7 Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:38 pm 
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Universal go server handle: hailthorn
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]



Bob: Important message of the day folks: Only YOU can prevent forest fires. And that is seriously good advice.

Dave: Oh shut up Bob and eat your taco. There's a game of Go going on and you're talking about forest fires!

Bob: Fine, fine. Interesting opening. Seen it only about a thousand times before. Black opens with Sanrensei. Can black play it well enough?

Dave: We'll find out shortly! But the Sanrensei helped Black get from around 12 Kyu to 11 Kyu, so I suppose he has some skill with it.

Bob: Yeah, against DDK's. This is a SDK he's playing. Entirely different ballgame Dave.

Dave: Good point, Bob. If he takes his time and reads, this could be competitive.

Bob: And if pigs fly, they probably have wings. You just pointed out the obvious, Dave. But we'll see how White responds to the Sanrensei!

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #8 Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 6:27 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 . . . . . . . . . 6 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I'm not going to waste time on the left - it only generates the sort of game I'm not very good at (and not very interested in). I hesitated over which corner stone to approach, but ultimately I have a lot less confidence in using 3-4 stones, and black's response to this will probably tell me how to handle the upper left better. I suspect black will pincer to try to make the top side uninteresting and negate the direction of my 3-4 stone; if black just bounces off and takes territory by jumping from :b1:, fine by me. Pincer would lead to fun, though I haven't decided what sort of fun yet.

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #9 Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:17 pm 
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Hm, I think I'm going to take some time and think on this one. The obvious move is....well obvious. Usually I pincer here without question. But I want to see if I can think of any decent alternatives.

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #10 Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 4:47 pm 
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Universal go server handle: hailthorn
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 . . . . . . . 7 . 6 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Pretty standard response. I decided this would be a good place to play. Go with what you know. Especially in the early goings. The marked moves seem to be the usual responses. More so the 3-3 here. I'm very familiar with both of them. So I'll see how White responds. :batman:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 . . . . . . . 7 . 6 . . M . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . M . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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Post #11 Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 11:11 pm 
Honinbo
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For beginners.
hailthorn011 wrote:
The obvious move is....well obvious.
There is no ONE single obvious move for :b7: -- there are multiple moves that are equally good.

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #12 Posted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 7:28 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 . . . . . . . 7 . 6 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . 8 . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I don't really have any experience in playing against the sanrensei. Might as well play a fighty variation - I'm not actually sure this is any good for me. For the record, I also considered this fighty variation:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . c 0 7 8 9 . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . X . O 6 3 1 . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . b 5 4 X 2 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . a . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . d . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]


but decided I didn't want to turn it into an all-or-nothing fight so early. This is an interesting variation, though. After I capture :b8:, black a to try to shut white in, then white b. Black probably gets c at some point before white does, white can push against the right for a little while to gain strength and then pincer the M17 group. Hard fight for white, but probably not impossible, and it ruins the sanrensei.

I don't remember where I saw this happen, but it looked fun. Maybe in another game / when I'm ten stones stronger.

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #13 Posted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 7:08 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 . . . . . . . 7 . 6 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , 9 8 . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Interesting. I was not expecting this move. This should make things interesting as I have absolutely zero experience with this position when playing Sanrensei. Perhaps I'll learn something new here! But this is how I envision it going down:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #14 Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 1:04 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 . . . . . . . 7 . 6 . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , 9 8 0 . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . , . . . . . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This leaves me with plenty of options:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . b . . . |
$$ | . . . 4 . . . . . M a 7 . 6 . b b . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , 9 8 0 . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . c c . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . 5 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]


Black has a cut at a: that should allow me to settle myself easily (or, of course, if black pulls out his :b7: stone, it could lead to a fight, but I think that would be a mistake - :b9: starts to look very sad and isolated). There's plenty of opportunity for making shape around b. If I jump, I threaten invasions around c, so I can probably even jump in sente, unless black wants me to eat away at his territory very quickly. Even if I don't jump, I'm threatening playing at c; this means I get two weak groups, but black's corner stone is double approached, so I'll probably end up living one and sacrificing the other while black squirms. I'd have to read further, but at first glance I wouldn't be unhappy with that result. Anyway, I'm imagining black at X - otherwise :b9: starts looking a little silly.

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #15 Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 9:40 am 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . B . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This is what I diagrammed in my last post. I imagine that White will now target the cut.

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #16 Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 1:05 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . W X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I think I'd call black's move a big mistake here. There are four stones not immediately under attack (at least one of the other two will die, and the other may turn into a liability), and they're all on the same side, mostly inefficiently placed to make territory (on the fourth line) but having their influence cancelled out by the strong group in front of them. Some variations follow:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . 4 3 5 . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . 6 . . . 2 1 X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . 7 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

Pretty simple variation. I'm happy with this - I have a strong group right in front of the sanrensei, and I get the corner. Black can't reasonably approach the corner from the other direction - that leaves him with two weak groups and me with none.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . 5 3 4 7 . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . 6 2 1 Y . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

Triangle dies. Black 2, 6 etc. are left without a base. Lots of variations like this.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . 8 0 . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 6 5 3 4 . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . 7 2 1 X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . 9 Y O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

Nice idea if :b4: etc. are alive, but they're still not connected to the corner. Black can crawl left forever, or connect back to the corner. I'm happy with both. There are some seriously easy mistakes to make here too.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 2 5 . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . 3 1 X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . . X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . 4 . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

Dies again.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . 6 4 2 b . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . 7 5 3 1 Y . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . a . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

After black has pushed a million times, a and b are miai for me to live, and I have all the thickness in the world.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . 4 X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . 3 1 X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]


Black saves the stone. I live (in gote, and depending on a ladder - it's good for me now, but I might have to worry about it later). Black got a few points in the corner.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . a . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . 1 X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 b . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

Probably the best move is tenuki. Black gets a very big corner, but I get sente. If anything weird happens later I play at a. After all, if black doesn't seal off this corner, then later I'm going to be aiming at 2 or b as possible invasion points.

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #17 Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 12:27 pm 
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Universal go server handle: hailthorn
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . B O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #18 Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 1:03 pm 
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Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . W . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #19 Posted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 2:56 pm 
Lives in sente

Posts: 1161
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Rank: KGS 6k
Universal go server handle: hailthorn
Sorry for the slow response.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . B X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

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 Post subject: Re: hailthorn vs. billywoods #202
Post #20 Posted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 6:02 pm 
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No problem.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$c Cap- B: 0 W: 0
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . O W . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . X O X . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . X X O O . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This finishes the sequence locally. I wonder where my opponent will go next. Even though there's a weak group at the top, I can't help thinking that the right hand side is very big too. I've not read anything yet.

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