Life In 19x19
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Lost 25k game
http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=16955		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Jika [ Thu Oct 03, 2019 10:52 am ]
Post subject:  Lost 25k game


Hi,

I thought this did not look so bad, but since the battle was in my territory, I had almost no territory in the end.
Before he passed I thought maybe by entering his I can reduce his points, but would have been captured, I guess.

So, other than "make territory in the beginning" there must be rules such as "take the battle into your opponents territory"?

I'm not training specifically for 9x9.
I haven't read "81 little lions" yet.

But maybe there are hints to be made that can help me with playing on bigger board sizes as well?

Thank you!!

Attachments:
19785272-053-FabiánEstrella-Jika.sgf [661 Bytes]
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Author:  jlt [ Thu Oct 03, 2019 11:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost 25k game
Moves :b31:, :b33: and many others afterwards are useless. Can you see why?
Author:  Mike Novack [ Thu Oct 03, 2019 2:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost 25k game
Maybe more to the point, because you to that point you weren't doing THAT badly (and this is a hint that might help you on bigger boards)

At move 23, WHY were you frightened by those four white stones inside your territory? Can you see any way they could form a live group? <<Imean,that you would not be able to prevent.

So a sente hane and connect at the bottom (because if white plays hane at the top it isn't sente for her, your block threatens that stone). Then you get the top hane too. You are WAY ahead. See what happens if white then tries to form a live group for those four surrounded stones (how you could prevent that)
Author:  Jika [ Thu Oct 03, 2019 10:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost 25k game
@jlt
Quote:
Moves :b31:, :b33: and many others afterwards are useless. Can you see why?


Quote:
frightened by those four white stones inside your territory? Can you see any way they could form a live group? <<Imean,that you would not be able to prevent.


This is the problem, I think.
I've had games where I was confident that an opponent's stones were dead, but then he enclosed some of mine and captured them or entered the territory I had assumed to be mine and lived there - and I did not see it coming or could not prevent it.

So, this time I thought, better play it safe and make sure this won't happen (again). I see I'm taking away my own territory with those moves, but I still don't think territory-wise. I see life or death (or I try to), but, well my inner counting is more Chinese. I've had that quite often that I thought "Oh, this looks good, I have more of the board", only to see my opponent win by a few points.

@mike:
I've had a look at move 23, but since white connects, where or in what move are those hane you mentioned? (I've read about hane (what it is!) and seen Kirby do that, but I'm afraid I don't get what those hanes you advise are here.

Would you make me a diagram??
Author:  jlt [ Thu Oct 03, 2019 11:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost 25k game
Mike was talking about this.

I can understand you were afraid of the three white stones, but at least at move 31 you should have seen that the white stones don't have enough space to form two eyes, and played the suggested sequence.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$ -------------------
$$ | . . 6 5 7 . . . . |
$$ | . . 8 O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . O X X . X . |
$$ | . . O , . . X . . |
$$ | . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . X . X O . |
$$ | . . . O X O O . . |
$$ | . . 4 O X . . . . |
$$ | . . 2 1 3 . . . . |
$$ -------------------[/go]


P.S. On the other hand, the following may be dangerous...
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$
$$ -------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X . X . . |
$$ | . . . O X X . X . |
$$ | . . O , . . X . . |
$$ | . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O . X . X O . |
$$ | . . . O X O O . . |
$$ | . . . O X 2 . . . |
$$ | . . . 1 . . . . . |
$$ -------------------[/go]
Author:  Jika [ Fri Oct 04, 2019 11:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Lost 25k game
@jlt:

Thanks a lot - I was looking at the totally wrong places!
I thought Mike was talking about some hane on the white group in the bottom right!
As in the game, I had no idea you were talking about my border group!

@Mike:

I'll see if Sabaki can digest the file (or the position only) to try out variants.
I have no good experience with eidogo sgf in tree-view editors, but I can go back to OGS and play variants there, of course.
Do you think I'd better set this up on a board?
I tend to forget what moves I've already tried compared to tree-view.

Thank you both!!
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