Life In 19x19 :: A strange opening move

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A strange opening move http://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=9290	Page 1 of 1

Author:

tekesta [ Fri Nov 01, 2013 9:29 am ]

Post subject:

A strange opening move

I was playing a game on IGS a few days back. I lost the game by 15 points or so, but the outstanding thing about it was an opening move that caught me unawares. That is, White 6. Whether it was a punishable mistake or a clever opening move, I would've not known how to take advantage of it. Not to mention that, yet again, I let my opponent have two nice corner territories :mrgreen:

Below is the game record. Much obliged in advance for your kind commentary.

Attachments:

AOXHKXYJTW.sgf [4.9 KiB]
Downloaded 529 times

Author:	Chew Terr [ Fri Nov 01, 2013 9:39 am ]
Post subject:	Re: A strange opening move
I cannot offer a full review, as I am on my phone. However, I do not think w6 is to be feared unduly. I would probably use d17 to calmly block off your corner. If white tries to attack your top middle stone immediately with l17, you can extend from your top right to counterattack. This leaves your weak middle stone sandwiched between two weak white groups. White cannot pressure severely until both are stable, and you are likely to gain territory on one or both sides in the meantime.

Author:	Bill Spight [ Fri Nov 01, 2013 11:03 am ]
Post subject:	Re: A strange opening move
There is a joseki where White approaches the top left corner at F-17, and then Black responds at D-17, and then White extends to J-17, to make a base. Since Black already has a stone at J-17, White cannot play there. Normal play is at D-17 to take away White's potential base. If White runs at this point, so much the better for Black. must cut at G-17. Try it, and you'll see why. must hane at Q-13. That's not only a good play, it is consistent with Black's previous two plays.

Author:	EdLee [ Fri Nov 01, 2013 12:09 pm ]
Post subject:
As usual, it's not an "opening move" here and there that's the problem. It's your basics. In this case, contact fights. What Bill said: Bill Spight wrote: must cut at G-17. must hane at Q-13.

Author:	quantumf [ Fri Nov 01, 2013 1:09 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: A strange opening move
16 is so bad that even after 20 at H16, you can STILL play G17 successfully.

Author: ez4u [ Fri Nov 01, 2013 6:40 pm ]

Post subject: Re: A strange opening move

A few thoughts on the early going...

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Wc White's next play is what (I)? $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . 2 . 1 . . X . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Wc White's next play is what (II)? $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X O O . . X . . X . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X X X X O O . , . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Wc White's next play is what (III)? $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X O O . . X . . X . . . . 2 . . | $$ | . . X X X X O O . , . . . . . X . 1 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Wc If you really want to cut... $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X O O . . X . . X . . . . X . . | $$ | . . X X X X O O . , . . . . . X . O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 4 O 2 . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Wc Connect and strengthen your stones. Now C3 and R3 are miai? $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . | $$ | . . O X O O . . X . . X . . . . X O . | $$ | . . X X X X O O . , . . . . . X O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X O . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O X O . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 X . . O . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . X . . . 1 . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Click Here To Show Diagram Code: [go]$$Wc Always continue with \n "a" is not an option here, leaving 2 for White $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . | $$ | . . O X O O . . X . . X . . . . X O . | $$ | . . X X X X O O . , . . . . . X O O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X X O . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X O . . | $$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . X X X O O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O O X O . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . X X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . 2 . . . a . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . 1 X . . . . . . . . . X X . . | $$ | . . . . O X . . . . . . . X . . O . . | $$ | . . . O . O X . . X . . . O . O . . . | $$ | . . . . . O X . . . . . O . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Author:	moyoaji [ Fri Nov 01, 2013 9:58 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: A strange opening move
Your fear seems to be a white counter-attack, but this doesn't go so well... Click Here To Show Diagram Code `[go]$$Wc $$ -------------------------- $$ \| . . . . . . . . . . . . . $$ \| . . . . . . . . . . . . . $$ \| . . . 2 . 1 . . X . 3 . . $$ \| . . X , . . . b . , . . . $$ \| . . . . . . . 4 a . . . . $$ \| . . . . . . . . . . . . .[/go]` After (possibly at a or b instead - I personally like the keima) white now has two weak groups. This is every go player's worst nightmare. 2 weak groups usually equates to a lost game because as black moves toward the center he is making his middle group stronger and, consequently, attacking both white groups, but white has to pick which to defend on each move. Remember that when you play the Low Chinese, you want your opponent to approach the 3-4 stone so that you have something to attack. This is why you will see professional players approaching the 4-4 stone first when their opponent plays the Low Chinese against them. It used to be common to approach the 3-4 on the outside instead, usually a long-knight's approach on the 4th line. I still see this move from time to time and there is nothing really wrong with it. However, your opponent approached the bottom from the inside, which is what you want since the middle stone is already a pincer. An inside approach two spaces away is hard for white since he can't even comfortably make a 1-point base. He just has to run.

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