Thank you! And sorry for the late reply. I'm kind of drawn towards StarCraft 2 at the moment ^^

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My "guide" to become stronger in Go

Uhhh, working at some problems again and my hiatus certainly lead to a decreased reading skill. I'm at Yi Ch'ang-Ho's L&D volume 2 right now and I already got a couple wrong. If I remember correctly I could just browse through this volume last year :X

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My "guide" to become stronger in Go

Re-discovered goproblems.com (245 problems and ongoing)! They have some sort of ranking system now, I like that very much. Maybe I'm not that bad at reading. Or their 6D-problems are falsely tagged ^^

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My "guide" to become stronger in Go

I really like doing problems on goproblems.com at the moment. They appear much more "fresh" compared to book problems. Most likely because a lot of them are taken from actual games.

But results-wise I'm so much worse than... well, before ^^ In my regular games with another Go-club-member I'm now down from giving 4H to 2H. And he does not study Go at all :o On the other hand, it's not like that this would be a new experience in Go ^^

My biggest obstacle is not having a plan/a strategy. I remember a recent game on two stones against the local Dan-player. I had lost all my starting advantage by move 30 because I played two bad moves. And this was by far no fighting game. I just blocked from the wrong side (which was major but I did also end in Gote because I played Honte locally instead of assessing the whole board to play big and using my handicap stones to attack) and played an aweful slow move to "help" a running group.
Quite contrary to doing problems, I'm not assessing the board at a given time. I play mostly by instinct or by patterns. I had a lively discussion with the same Dan-player the other day, where he said that he prefers to discover his moves/strategies in the actual game as part of the creativity of Go wheras I am much more comfortable with knowing beforehand how to react in certain situations (e.g. knowing the Joseki, the follow-up, opening patterns, knowing how to exploit the Aji in common shapes, common vital points in middlegame like reductions/invasions etc.).
Maybe I'm too used to get spoon-fed knowledge and rely on the fact that I can read about or learn from another person everything there is to know. I blame my school education.

On a more serious note, I think this "not discovering for myself" vastly hinders my progress. Since I don't know a lot, I'm lost in a aweful lot of situations. I guess I simply have to start thinking again. Better have a plan going wrong than having no plan at all, eh? Maybe throw in a couple of pro games to tune my feeling a little bit.

And problems of course, I love'em : )
Maybe some readers will remember my book-list, I had planned to go through:

1. YCH Tesuji vol. 1
2. YCH L&D vol. 1
3. Get Strong at the Opening
4. YCH Tesuji vol. 2
5. YCH L&D vol. 2
6. 501 Opening Problems
7. YCH Tesuji vol. 3
8. YCH L&D vol. 3
9. YCH Tesuji vol. 4
10. YCH L&D vol. 4

I'm now at 501 Opening Problems. I think I will need to go through this book (and Get Strong at the Opening) at least three-times to get every problem right :X

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My "guide" to become stronger in Go

Since it's a wonderful coincidence, I like to share that I'm on problem 361 now. Still a couple more to go to finish 501 Opening Problems.

As I started with opening problems, I was mainly concerned about some feeling for direction, maybe getting to know some patterns or common moves in certain situations but I slowly begin to realize that this put the cart before the horse. Of course due to the static diagrammes, you have to assess the whole board and question the strength of every group, the boundary play between each Moyo or finding the right time to invade/reduce, but since I replay games from John Fairbairn's last book on games of Honinbo Shuei at the same time, I came across a remarkable comment about the opening: Opening moves should aim at a follow-up, they shouldn't stand by themselves, justified only because they are "big" but they should have an extended use as the board develops.
This sounds so simple, I never even thought about it. I only thought about "bigness" like extending from a corner enclosure or approaching.

I'm taking some freedom and give a short summary of the mentioned part in the book:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wc The Games of Honinbo Shuei, Vol 4 - Game 8
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . B . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . O . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . e . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . b . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , 1 . . |
$$ | . . d . . . . . . . . . . . . c . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . 2 . . a . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

White is Shuei. The masterplayer. He plays , extension from a corner enclosure. Very sound, I can follow.
To maybe rewind one move: Black decided to play the marked move instead of neglecting White the extension to (it's Shuei, d'uh! Marked stone and are Miai). This is commented as a somewhat negative attitude.

Back to . It's common follow-up is 'a', but 'a' lacks appeal because White has P3 in place, low and solid. Black should have played at 'b', to have 'c' later on and thus eliminating any growing framework from White there. (My interpretation of 'b' is that it's a little farer away so that any wall, White might get due to the shoulder-hit at 'c' does not have a big impact on 'b', e.g. pincering it.)
'd' is possible, too. This move aims at surrounding the White stone at the top with 'e' and making a framework for Black.
As John Fairbairn writes: It is the follow-up that counts.

Some moves later in the game:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Bc The Games of Honinbo Shuei, Vol 4 - Game 8
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X , . O . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . a . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . W . . . c . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . O X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . b . O X . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X . . . . O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Black still plays later on, ignoring the marked White move. It extends from the corner and prevents a White play there, which I learned is a big move. We saw the follow-up of , it's 'a'. But its value is diminished now, since Black has already a strong prosition at the bottom looking to reduce any kind of White framework the right side might produce.
'b' is considered to be better here, aiming at attacking at 'c'.

So now, I try to keep this idea present, to not play moves in the opening because they are just big in the book but because I know what I can do with them later on. I have the feeling that might help me overcoming the no-strategy obsatcle.

And go buy Fairbairn's books on Shuei's games. There are more jewels to be discovered =)

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My "guide" to become stronger in Go

This sounds so obvious that it doesn't even need mentioning, and yet I now realise that it is (almost?) completely lacking from my play. Thanks for sharing. Your post was really interesting.

Completed my first run of solving 501 Opening Problems. Yi Ch'ang-Ho's Selected Tesuji Problems 3 is next. First eleven problems have already been solved correctly =)


post scriptum: And I'm also thorugh with volume four of Shuei's games. I'm now tackling volume three and then maybe re-do volume four.

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My "guide" to become stronger in Go

What would You say about 501 Opening Problems book? I wonder is its difficulty is appropriate for kgs 1k ?

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Formerly Gorim

Well, I'm around 2k and I got at least 1/3 to half of the problems wrong. For me it's appropriate, and I think I learned a lot while doing the problems (intuition-wise).

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My "guide" to become stronger in Go

Almost through Yi Ch'ang-Ho's Selected Tesuji Problems 3, but I'm not focussed lately, so I get a lot of moves wrong or I did not read the strongest counter (counts as solved wrong in my book) since I mostly just "feel" for the right move.

I'm home now at my parents over the holidays, so I have a different environment and naturally I like to see and spend time with some old mates. That's why I'm very shaky with my training regime. I maybe solve five problems a day compared to the 30 (mainly via goproblems.com) I did in the last weeks. And I did not replay a Shuei game in a long time now.

Then I'm not faithful to Go. I still play StarCraft 2, which is as time-consuming as Go can be, and I couldn't resist buying Guild Wars 2 at a highly reduced priced the other day (it's awesome!).

So lots and lots of stuff to choose from, but since folks around here are more into StarCraft 2, I neglect Go for now.

But I'm confident this will pass. Back at my place, I have more Go-players around and when the weekly meetings start again, all will be well, I assume. On top of that, I have a really nice wish-list for Christmas and I'm looking forward to browse through the following:

• First Kyu
• A Way of Play Go for the 21st Century
• A dictionary of modern Fuseki: The Korean Style
• ...and maybe I'll treat myself to 21st Century Dictionary of basic Joseki vol. 2

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My "guide" to become stronger in Go

I always whined about the time lost since I discovered Go so late. (Wonder what it would have done in my school days...)

And now, at my parents, hidden under a bed in a room rarely used, mixed up with various sheets of coloured paper and (old) games I found Ravensburger's Go + Gobang. And seeing its cover I remembered this packet from my childhood. It was always laying there - waiting! And I never even opened it (the plastic bags with the plastic stones are still closed).

Worlds are breaking apart :X

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My "guide" to become stronger in Go

When I was young we got this book of games that came with black and white glass markers. There were maybe 18-20 games in the book, like mancala and checkers and, of course, go. I think I played it once and never looked back until 10-15 years later. That game was too confusing.

As thought, I'm back at being a Go nut.

I happily got every Go-book I wished for at christmas and started firstly with reading "First Kyu". Never read such a devastating end so far... Although the perverse thing is that I'm now really pumped to get stronger. Are we Go-players not a funny masochistic bunch? =)

So, it's again 20 problems on goproblems.com (range 5k to 4d), round about 20 problems from Yi Ch'ang-Ho's Tsumego vol. 3 and replaying two games from Games of Honinbo Shuei vol. 3 (I'm at game 8 so far) a day.

My Go club also started this week again and I feel like I'm bouncing between ranks. End of last year when I followed the above study regime I could play one fellow Go player on 4H (as White), after losing on 3H before following the study regime. Now I'm back at losing on 3H again ^^

I feel like my biggest obstacle is still overall strategy: Making the game broader, direction of play, balance etc. It's definitely not reading because when I do it mostly turns out good =D

But, well, well, I still stick to the plan of cycling through these books while doing problems online (more variety) and replaying games.

1. YCH Tesuji vol. 1
2. YCH L&D vol. 1
3. Get Strong at the Opening
4. YCH Tesuji vol. 2
5. YCH L&D vol. 2
6. 501 Opening Problems
7. YCH Tesuji vol. 3
8. YCH L&D vol. 3
9. YCH Tesuji vol. 4
10. YCH L&D vol. 4

With replaying games I'd like to stick to Shuei for the moment. I already been through vol. 4 once and I plan on replaying all the games in vol. 3 and 4 at least three times (First time with commentary and more for the feel. Second time more thinking about each diagramme and then reading the commentary again. Third time even more thinking and figuring out the moves while using Ten's guide to studying professional games). I figured since he matured late, his later games will show his real strength.

That's the plan at least : ) I'm still unsure how or if I should include other books like "A Way of Play Go for the 21st Century". But well, let's try it out: Flowing water does not fight what lies ahead =)

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My "guide" to become stronger in Go

Did you also get 21st Century Dictionary of Basic Joseki Vol. 2, and are you enjoying it?

Why do you enjoy studying Shuei and his games? I also think his games from 1892-1895 are instructive too. They take me back down to Earth and make his later games easier to understand.

501 Opening Problems is a slice of a certain kind of play -- so I find it interesting to compare in relation to Shuei, and when thinking about games played after the book was published.

No, not yet. I think I am going to buy it in the next couples of months. It was not available in my store of choice before christmas.
On the other hand, I'm still unsure whether I should "study" Joseki just yet and if yes, I don't know how it would be most benificial :o



Good question! But I can't really explain it. I think it's partly because I do have his games with very good commentary. Another aspect is that I like his "style". I like how he plays lightly, how deep his reading is and his positional judgement (I never know he will get many points in the center until he does...). The whole Miai-business and playing the player from time to time is also very fascinating.
But overall I'm far too weak to really comment on his games. Mostly I just quote the commentary, so I don't really understand his play at all ^^
Right now it's more feeling and appreciating the beauty of his moves. Sometimes moves just send thrills down my spine - just by the look of them : D

The main reason I stick to the latter games is because I like my hero to play awesome and win ; ) I also have the feeling, I could learn more from games from his prime - maybe unjustified.
When I'm strong enough to see "mistakes", respectively certain mindsets in his games which are similiar to amateur dan-players, I gladly look at his other games but sadly I am far away from this.



Yes, I also think that's very interesting! For instance: One of the last games I replayed commented on the famous Shusaku Fuseki and said that by now (meaning back in Shuei's time), Fuseki theory evolved and that Shusaku's Fuseki is not the best way to play for Black (in detail: Black should enclose the corner on move five and not take the remaining open corner). Later Go Seigen will say, the open corner is always bigger? : D

Fuseki is indeed very interesting, by now my favourite part of the game : )

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My "guide" to become stronger in Go

Finished Yi Ch'ang-Ho's Tsumego vol. 3 today and I am starting his Tesuji vol. 4. If I remember correctly this volume was rather easy despite it being volume four out of six. The Tsumego problems do get harder with every volume, the Tesuji ones jump around a bit.
After that comes - right - volume four of the Tsumego problems. When I worked at it the first time I had to lay it aside after a douzen or so problems because I was practically clueless as how to solve the them. I'm curious how I will do now.

Then starts the fun part: Re-doing everything from the circle and checking if I do better. I marked every wrong problem from the Yi Ch'ang-Ho series, so I can easily check them but I sadly didn't do this for the opening problems, so I have to go by feeling and mark the wrong ones this time.
My goal is to get around 95% right in every book.

I also started to go through "A way of play for the 21st century" by Go Seigen. I read and replayed the second chapter "Study of Komoku" (since they are obviously played often in games by Shuei - he even gets mentioned in Go Seigen's book =) ) and discovered a lot of nice ideas. I won't say I understand everything about them and at some points I clearly don't understand why he doesn't explain another (for me obvious) move but it seems I just don't have the proper understanding how to maintain balance in the game of Go - which seems to be one of the main focal points of this book.
Anyhow - I'm thrilled to experiment with some of his concepts : )

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My "guide" to become stronger in Go

Hello, my name is SoDesuNe and when I play Go, I have the bad habit of not assessing my move.

- (all) Hello SoDesuNe!

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wc Black to play and lose the game
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . . . X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X 3 . . . . . . . . . . . O . . |
$$ | . . O 1 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . X . . . . . X . O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Thank you! You all have been very kind and helpful. Cookies?

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My "guide" to become stronger in Go

So what was the response?

@skydyr

I see many ways White MIGHT take advantage ... but I agree I'm not sure at the loss. I'm weaker than he is, though, so maybe he's reading something I'm not.

My impression is that black's move isn't spectacular, but is by no means a losing move on its own, so either black made more mistakes in the sequence that followed, or there is a white sequence I missed.