KGS Main Room Policy

[Kirby]

Pretty much every time a particular KGS admin participates in game kibitz, it's to indicate to users that are chatting about a non-go related topic, "Keep the discussion on the game".

While undeniably an admirable aspiration for kgs users to discuss go, it does not appear to be against the TOS to discuss "off-topic" conversations in game rooms.

Upon indicating this to said admin, I was directed to the main room policy:

Main Rooms Policy

First, KGS is a family-aimed server. The main chat rooms should be appropriate for people of any age from any culture. This mean no swear words, no sex related conversations, references to illegal drugs, etc(see the current Terms of Service).
Second, the primary purpose of the main chat rooms are to help users with go and KGS.
Any discussion unrelated to either go or KGS will be tolerated only if it doesn't interfere with this aim and the first point.
If questions from users are (or would be) flooded in such a conversation, then the conversation should either stop or move to another room.
"Off-topic" discussions, while often tolerated, are not the purpose of the main rooms.
Discussions of a religious or political nature can quickly become heated and disruptive, so are not allowed in the main rooms.
Note: Long discussions in a language other than the room's default language should move to the main room dedicated to that language. This does not apply to conversations with lost newbies.
The admins enforce the main room policy and the TOS. They can terminate a user's connection without warning and they can ban them from KGS. Newbies asking questions are treated more leniently than regular users.

Now, I am not an English major or a lawyer, but I am a native speaker of English. While this text indicates that off-topic discussions are not the main purpose of the game rooms, it clearly indicates that they are tolerated.

The only exception to this is if said discussion interferes with "helping users with go and KGS". Admittedly, what constitutes interference is ambiguous, but it angers me that particular enforcement deems any off topic discussion as such. In all cases I have observed, no "help" was being provided to other users, so the presence or absence of off-topic discussion was absolutely unrelated.

The help page should be updated to correlate with (particular) admin actions: off-topic chat not allowed in game rooms.

Otherwise, policy is not correctly being enforced.

[UnclMartin]

This issue seems to be not about main room policy, but about kibitz policy.

Especially when there are many observers in a game, kibitz policy is more restrictive than room policy. Policy regarding game chat (kibitz) is not necessarily the same as the policy of the rooms in which the games are played.

It is unfortunate, but some help pages are not always up to date, and some pages may be inconsistent with each other.

For the record, following is what, at the time Kirby started this thread, one of the help pages had about game kibitz. This was on the same newbie FAQ help page with and just below the Main Rooms Policy quoted by Kirby.

Game Kibitz Policy

• Same as above but replace "help users" with "commenting on the game" and "questions from users" with "comments on the game".
• Note: All languages are welcome in game kibitz.

This is my current edit:

Game Chat Policy

• The "family-aimed" policy described in the first item of the Main Rooms Policy above applies to all public games.
  
• The "family-aimed" policy applies to players and observers.
  
• Chat by observers of games in progress should be restricted to discussion of that particular game.
  
• The more observers in a game, the more likely it is an admin will enforce this.
  
• Please remember that many observers hope to learn by watching a game, and by watching and possibly participating in the game chat. Off-topic discussion in game chat makes it harder for them to do that.
  
• Note: All languages are welcome in game chat

.

This is what another help page says, and is relevant to the discussion:

Observing a game on KGS can be almost as much fun as playing one yourself (and less of a commitment, if you are liable to be called away from your computer). KGS has many features to help with observing games. It is easy to observe games: in the main window, you just click on one or more of the games listed.

Some games are private. You cannot watch one of these, unless you are invited to join it.

You can chat while observing a game, but, try to keep your comments related to the game. In rated and free games, the players can not see your comments. However, in a Teaching game (indicated by a T to the left of the game in the main window) the teacher and pupil can see your remarks, so you should avoid chatting without their permission.

(Emphasis mine.)

A mention about the TOS and admin policy is relevant here:

The TOS are the top-level principles of KGS use. Admins have policies to enforce the TOS. While only WMS can change the TOS, admins discuss and change admin policy. By analogy, you can think of the TOS as a constitution, and admin policy as either laws or as agency regulations.

Note: As of the time I posted this, and made the help page edit, I had not yet discussed the edit with other KGS admins, but I believe it does accurately reflect game chat policy in effect for at least as long as I have been an admin.