jann wrote:
Something like
J89 has for bent4, or simply yours modified?
- Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ ---------------------------
$$ | . X . X X O X . X . X O . . |
$$ | X O X . X O O X X X X O . . |
$$ | O O X X X O . O X O O O . . |
$$ | . O O O X O O X X O . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . O X O . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X X X X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------[/go]
jann wrote:
Something like
J89 has for bent4, or simply yours modified?
- Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ ---------------------------
$$ | . X . X X O X . X . X O . . |
$$ | X O X . X O O X X X X O . . |
$$ | O O X X X O . O X O O O . . |
$$ | . O O O X O O X X O . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O . O X O . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O X X X X X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------[/go]
Oh yes I see. It looks like the example 16 and it was difficult for me to make a decision. Now I see your point:
If I say that we have to follow the result of normal play then black cannot be killed. But in the other hand, by choosing this example, the author of J89 claimed that the expected result should be that black is dead and, by using the pass-for-ko the author proved she can reach this expected result.
I had to find a way to resolve this problem and be sure it was not that easy.
My proposal was to identify "advantageous" loop and that sounds in my head as something like:
If a player has a advantageous loop and this loop cannot be break in normal play that means that firstly this player cannot lose this game (she can always force a NO RESULT game) and secondly that means that this player can always stops the game (the game cannot continue forever providing the number of resumption is not unlimited). In such specific situation, in GT territory rule, I can say black stones may be considered as dead in order to give a reward in the confirmation phase, reward that normal play fails to recognize (no superko).
The GT territory rule logic becomes:
To respect as far as possible J89 in all situations were an advantageous loop is detected and in all other situations except if the result given by J89 contradicts normal play inside "enable" region.
The point is always the same : the idea is not to change J89 but, because a lot of problems has been detected (in particular by Robert Jasiek) the idea is to present the rule differently to try and resolve these problems. Yes the goal is not that ambitious because in practice I am sure J89 works perfectly. Though my preference goes to an area rule I found interesting to go deeper in J89 to try and propose a different view with the same objective.
jann wrote:
Maybe your rules are simply too complicated and prone to honest misunderstandings and application errors.
I have well noted this point Jann. I am working for a still less ambitious rule with the objective to clarify J89 ambiguities and to be far less complicated.