Life In 19x19

Überdude - I think this is the way to kill the corner (well it's ko).

Game 17
I've been continuing trying to foster a more conservative style and it seems to be paying off. I've had 8 wins out of the last 9 games - and pretty solid wins at that. The one loss was foolish - I missed two moderate sized double Ataris in a row and ended up loosing by 8 points.

The one theme I have noticed in the games is a proliferation of one point jump running battles. I have to confess I do not understand their subtleties and find them vaguely terrifying. If I'm in the middle I feel that my opponent is going to turn around and slice my column of stones into a thousand pieces. If I'm on the outside I feel that the snake I have by the tail will turn and bite me. So far I've done ok out of them though.

This game was an interesting one. I can't say it was one of my better wins - so I thought it would make a good one to share. In particular I've been wondering about what to do in response to move 15.

S2W wrote:Game 17
This game was an interesting one. I can't say it was one of my better wins - so I thought it would make a good one to share. In particular I've been wondering about what to do in response to move 15.

Some strange ideas of how to fight in this game.

This should be OK, but then must extend further because Black can still cut at N3. The alternative is just the hanging connection at M3, when White has more efficient shape.

The invasion point on the right is probably R8, but it might still be early. After there is still a way in that might work at R9, aiming at R7 and an ko.

looks wimpy: have to try double hane in these positions.

Need to count the game before making this exchange.

I'd be looking at L5 atari, Black L4, White at K6. Both sides have bad shape, but White needs a plan to attack Black on the upper side.

Pushing the weak black groups together: can't approve.

But it works out for White, given that is very weak and "automatic".

A few comments on the opening.

Charles - thanks again for your comments - they are very instructive as always.

With regard to fighting - good technique is a bit of a mystery to me. It seems there's lots to study about the opening, endgame fuseki joseki etc but how to fight seems to be a matter of a) play more go, b) read deeper. Is this basically it or is there something more fundamental that I'm missing that makes for my "strange ideas"?

Bill - thanks also - every time I read your reviews I realize how little I know about the game. How/where did you learn to play?

S2W wrote:how to fight seems to be a matter of a) play more go, b) read deeper.
Is this basically it or is there something more fundamental that I'm missing...

It's the basics. The fundamentals, all of them. It's huge.

Game 18
I'm not sure if it's been luck, a change in opponents, swapping from tea to coffee, or if something has clicked but my games have been going well for a couple of weeks now (touch wood). I'm still not quite at the 8k level though - the couple of games I've played against 8-6 kyus on igs have still been close and not good enough to win without the handicap. Conversely my games against 9-12ks have been pretty comfortable (if we conveniently ignore yesterday's pummeling (I was watching tv)). For me at least it does feel like there is a but of a barrier at this rank.

With that in mind here's a recent game I played against a 8kyu. A win, but not enough without Komi. Partly I felt too comfortable in the later game and slacked off. But I'm still a bit mystified how it got so close (and what to do to bridge the Komi gap).

Some thoughts:

Your second option R10 would be much better. R10 works together with your upper side and your lower side, building a large framework on the right. White would have to come in to prevent this, but with R10 in place whites invasion group could be easily attacked, allowing you to make profit.
R14 on the other hand, the move you played is only working together with your upper side, leaving white enough spaces to invade the right side and destroy your potential without much risk.
I don't like this move. After whites invasion you have two options, defend the corner and let white escape towards the middle or let white take the corner and take the influence - you decided to take the second. But because of whites previous invasion on the right side, you don't have a large framework, with which the influence could work together. P8 is really close to your new influence, which means you don't get that much points from it, probably less than white gets from taking the corner. So taking the corner would have been bigger.
Also when taking the corner, white would have to extend towards the left side to make a base, but there you already have L3. And if white would try to escape upwards towards the center P8 might become useful. All in all, if you would have defended the corner (R3 or R2, not sure about the correct tactical move) you not only would have gotten secure profit, but also made white weak.
Yes i would also say this is a mistake. C14 and C6 are both on the third line which means both corner are closed by white. Then there is nothing to be gained by playing near them, you don't threaten whites corner, so white can easily play the pincer to attack you.
If you want to play on the left side, to prevent white from taking it, i would have played D10. For one this is the move i would also like to play as white on this side, so by playing it as black i can easily prevent white from doing so. Another reason is, that because if invaded on the third line white would definitely pincer and there is not enough room to make a base. So every invasion black could play there would be attacked, allowing white to profit from it. But D10 is on the fourth line, which makes it more like a reduction than an invasion. D10 doesn't have to make a base, it can easily escape towards the center to prevent being attacked.

Another option, instead of reducing whites left side, would be to increase the lower side moyo you built with P8 and P3. A move around H4 looks good. It would also defend a possible invasion point of white (around H3).

Yes J5 is to far away from the white stone to really threaten it and it leaves the possible gap at K4 (Elephant jump) which white could exploit later or force you to come back (losing sente). The keima looks much better.
The move you actually played is big, but i would agree that extending once more is urgent. You know the proverb "hane at the head of two stones"? Well your two stones are already haned at the head (J4) which means allowing white to play J7 would be really painfull.
White would not answer with H7, that is pushing from behind. Instead white may play a knight move (G8), jump (H8) or play tenuki, but still extending for black would be good.

Connecting is better. If you push white will play L18 and easily life on the side. Then you would again trade territory for influence. But with P12 and the possible hane at J7 i feel that white can easily erase your influence, so taking the secure cash is better. Also thanks to F15 the whites group now has a harder time to escape, which is good for you.

That looks really slow and small. I can see that you try to "cash in" your influence, but with the stable whites group on the right it is just not possible (Thats why going for influence at the top was not a good idea). If you want to use your influence at the top, then attack whites group on the right, starting with the peep at Q11. If white blocks at R11 to secure the base you can cut through and get a really nice moyo in the middle. If white answers the peep with Q12 you could try to rob whites base with S11 or S10. It is probably not possible to kill this group, but attacking it will allow you to secure your lower right moyo while white will (thanks to your upper side influence) play moves that make no points at all. That is what attacking is all about.

Yes, extending. Hane at the head of two is already painful. The second hane (hane at the "ass") is even more painful.

was already a mistake, you won't make it better by trying to save it. Just play K8 and protect your moyo.

That's it for the per-move comments. I may not be the best to give advice about the opening (that i'm pretty weak at it) but it seems to me you focus to much on influence, but then can't really use it well. Influence is used for attacking. The basic idea is to build a large framework with it, so big that your opponent has to invade - and then you use your influence to attack its group and make territory elsewhere.
If making such a big framework isn't possible anymore, because there are living groups of your opponent in the area, then don't go for the influence - take the territory instead.
Don't forget that if you are building influence you are paying for it with territory you give to your opponents. For this trade to be good you have to make a lot of points with your influence.

Also is very slow and achieves little. I don't much like p8, but if you are going to press from that direction to develop the lower side then after white's jump you should solidify that area. m7 looks appealing to me, and then you claim to be able to kill any invader (except perhaps give white a tripod group at r3) but that claim may be false. If you do play p14 you need to be consistent and make it do something useful by killing or severely attack white's side group but that is hard. Maybe if you q11 peeped first. p8 instead with q10 q12 combo to build a wall to develop the top side is another idea.

And the winner is ... Black 137.

I don't know if and how you did it but you judged yourself to be ahead IF you would not lose that corner and you spent a move defending it.
Before that, you took all the big endgame points and caught up from being slightly behind. Look at all the diagonals 109, 129 and 131: you got them all in sente. White obliged and didn't even consider mutual damage.

I like a lot: after pestering White in his own ground, you go back to connect and expand. This flexible attitude is a sign of a good player, trying to be a few steps ahead of the opponent.

At you say you hate this position. Well, don't atari like but reinforce your weak stone instead. Atari on a cutting stone will always strengthen the cutting stone and weaken your own stone at the other side. That may be the right thing to do, if you want to sacrifice that stone or under special tactical circumstances. But if the outcome is not the plan, then change the execution and reconsider your urge to atari.

Well done!

EdLee wrote:

S2W wrote:how to fight seems to be a matter of a) play more go, b) read deeper.
Is this basically it or is there something more fundamental that I'm missing...

It's the basics. The fundamentals, all of them. It's huge.

That's kind of tautologous, though.

I like the idea of dividing up the difference between two ranks: normally the endgame counts for as much as 30%, I believe, though that perhaps comes down to 20% at some levels. The opening maybe averages out at 15% SFK and dans up to 4d (split differently between joseki and fuseki, though). So you can reckon that over half, say 55% to 65%, of what you need to improve is based on middlegame, i.e. how to fight.

It is therefore sort of possible to equate fighting strength with "real strength", for most amateurs. But as soon as you look it all more closely, that assertion dissolves. Ko fights are a decent example. Unless a ko is all-dominating, the decisions around it are based on some skills such as estimation of exchanges which are not just about reading.

Ko is a kind of extreme example of the "depth" of go: an innocuous-sounding rule leads to transformative changes in games that complete upset expectations. But there really are numerous other aspects of fighting that lead to what I would call "medium-sized subjects": certainly capturing races come to mind, bridging under is one that is neglected in most problem books, and one I don't even know the correct name of (snakily pulling out a key stone - oki theory?). You could spend quite a long time on Sakata's use of placements on the second line. You could spend time on pushing battles and crawling battles (but probably shouldn't, the latter anyway). There should be a book on all the kinds of nets, but I think there isn't.

Amateurs are basically smatterers in all of these things. We don't do kikashi properly, and the variations around the one-space enclosure are probably beyond us.

My "solution": play, and don't rely on reading to an extent that unbalances your game. On a plateau, do study some aspects of the game as technique, i.e. as self-contained medium-sized subjects. Really strong players have excellent positional judgement as well as reading, and they care about fuseki and the endgame. Because they mostly care more about winning than appearing strong.

MagicMagor wrote: Yes, extending. Hane at the head of two is already painful. The second hane (hane at the "ass") is even more painful.

This cracked me up - and it stuck in my head so much that the move just popped out at me the next time I played (mofo I'm going to hane yo ass!)

Thanks also for the very detailed review - if I wasn't so immature perhaps the rest would sink in as well . Thanks again.

Knotwilg wrote:And the winner is ... Black 137.

I don't know if and how you did it but you judged yourself to be ahead IF you would not lose that corner and you spent a move defending it.
Before that, you took all the big endgame points and caught up from being slightly behind.
...
Well done!

Thanks for the encouragement Knotwilg. I'd realized I needed the corner and that I was ahead at that point (if only slightly) so it seemed prudent to take it. I think that was one thing that I took away from 501 opening problems - the importance of securing a big point when you have to. Also I've been trying harder to recognize my own weaknesses - with some success (though too often it is still just _after I play a move).

Re the endgame plays I've noticed that basic endgame is often a weakness of many of the very aggressive/fighting style players. This surprised me at first because I would die on a large scale so often against them during yose but on reflection I think it makes sense. Often I think they are fishing during their attacks - trying to uncover weakness rather than read it out. If I don't respond correctly then they appear like reading geniuses but in reality the result reflects my poor response rather than their mastery. What it also means is that they may not be so practiced at looking for the best/most sente move (or if playing at a club - less invested in the outcome of the game at the end). So one current pet theory is that getting stronger at endgame might be a good way to get the upper hand at this level. (I still suck at it though).

Uberdude wrote:Also is very slow and achieves little. I don't much like p8, but if you are going to press from that direction to develop the lower side then after white's jump you should solidify that area.

Yes - the ability to know how and when to press an attack and when and how to break and take profit is still difficult for me. Some thing I've been working on but I have a long way to go.

Gloating

Q: Who's got two thumbs and has just ranked up on Igs?
A: This guy! Boo-yah!

Yep - sorry I haven't posted in a while but I've been too busy wiping the floor with my opponents.
But this is a journal after all and I thought I'd drop by and share my brand new rank - yep that's right - come to the store ... I got 8ks of pure fury for you right here! Oh what's that you ask - how's dgs looking? Funny you should mention it but eh-hem 4 kyu - no big deal - just 4 friggn k's baby!