Three priorities: Stay connected, make eyespace, and don't get sealed in. If I have a group fighting for life, I want it to be a fight that destroys the center.
$$Bcm39 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . X . O . W W W . | $$ | . . W , . . . X . , . . . . B X B . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . W . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , X . . . . X . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X X . . . . . . . 3 . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . 4 . b . X . . . . . | $$ | . . W X . . . . . , . O . . . X . . . | $$ | . . W O X X x X x 5 a c . W . d . . . | $$ | . . . . O W . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm39 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . X . O . W W W . | $$ | . . W , . . . X . , . . . . B X B . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . W . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , X . . . . X . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X X . . . . . . . 3 . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . 4 . b . X . . . . . | $$ | . . W X . . . . . , . O . . . X . . . | $$ | . . W O X X x X x 5 a c . W . d . . . | $$ | . . . . O W . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Also considered a-d. a and d both give black the opportunity to seal me in along the side. b is enticing, but I think the move I chose leads to a more favorable fight. If I live in the center and marked stone gets cut off, that's not a big deal to me, and there is aji at the x points.
I will almost certainly have to sacrifice the O3 stone. I hope I can profit enough in the center to make forming this weak group worth the cost, but I'm not sure that I will.
Re: Kingo Malkovitch#1: Jeromie vs. Hyperpape
Posted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 6:23 pm
by hyperpape
$$Bcm45 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . X . O . W W W . | $$ | . . W , . . . X . , . . . . B X B . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . W . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , X . . . . X . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X X . . . . . . a X b . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . O . 2 . X . . . . . | $$ | . . W X . . . . . O . O . . . X . . . | $$ | . . W O X X . X . X X . . O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . O W . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm45 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . X . O . W W W . | $$ | . . W , . . . X . , . . . . B X B . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . W . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , X . . . . X . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X X . . . . . . a X b . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . O . 2 . X . . . . . | $$ | . . W X . . . . . O . O . . . X . . . | $$ | . . W O X X . X . X X . . O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . O W . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
The ideas for me are a and b. b seems like the obvious shape move, and a would make a bad shape (peeping at both sides of a bamboo joint. That leaves the question of whether to play b as a king. It seems rather appealing.
Re: Kingo Malkovitch#1: Jeromie vs. Hyperpape
Posted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 9:01 am
by hyperpape
$$Bcm45 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . X . O . W W W . | $$ | . . W , . . . X . , . . . . B X B . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . W . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , X . . . . X . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X X . . . . . . . X # . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . O . 2 . X . . . . . | $$ | . . W X . . . . . O . O . . . X . . . | $$ | . . W O X X . X . X X . . O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . O W . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm45 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . X . O . W W W . | $$ | . . W , . . . X . , . . . . B X B . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . W . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , X . . . . X . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . b . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X X . . . . . . a X # . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . O . 2 . X . . . . . | $$ | . . W X . . . . . O . O . . . X . . . | $$ | . . W O X X . X . X X . . O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . O W . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
There is real risk that I could be in a situation where this stone needs to work to live. The question, however, is not whether that's a risk. It's whether managing that risk by playing more safely is likely to cost me multiple points. I'm not so sure.
Btw: I say multiple points, because once you've played one king, it becomes substantially easier to play further ones. Of course, not all would be: for instance, if White plays a, I'll respond with a non-king at b.
Re: Kingo Malkovitch#1: Jeromie vs. Hyperpape
Posted: Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:27 am
by schultz
Not for players.
I'm still waiting for there to be more direct play around the kings. Ed mentioned some possibilities around C14 and seems to me that black could work that to an advantage forcing around an instant lose piece. Seems like now would be the time to try and work that to an advantage before we move to far into the middle game.
Thanks for continuing this game. It's been fun to watch so far, and looking forward to more!
Re: Kingo Malkovitch#1: Jeromie vs. Hyperpape
Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 7:31 pm
by hyperpape
It's been the holidays, so I'm just double checking that you saw my last move.
Re: Kingo Malkovitch#1: Jeromie vs. Hyperpape
Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 8:14 pm
by jeromie
Yes, sorry!
I was very busy over the holidays and now I’m starting a new semester at work. I haven’t forgotten about the game!
Re: Kingo Malkovitch#1: Jeromie vs. Hyperpape
Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2018 2:09 pm
by jeromie
$$Bcm45 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . X . O . W W W . | $$ | . . W , . . . X . , . . . . B X B . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . W . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , X . . . . X . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X X . . . . . . . X B . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . O . 2 . X . . . . . | $$ | . . W X . . . . . O . O . . . X . . . | $$ | . . W O X X . X . X X @ . O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . O W . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm45 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . X . O . W W W . | $$ | . . W , . . . X . , . . . . B X B . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . W . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , X . . . . X . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X X . . . . . . . X B . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . O . 2 . X . . . . . | $$ | . . W X . . . . . O . O . . . X . . . | $$ | . . W O X X . X . X X @ . O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . O W . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Sorry for the long delay!
I've got myself in a bit of a pickle here. I want to jump out into the middle, but I need to take care of my group first. With this move, I admit that my group is heavy and start adding kings to it. I don't think there is anyway I can sacrifice this group and still have any hope of winning the game. I honestly think I've handled the group on the bottom poorly and it's very unlikely I'll win at this point, but it's not quite time to resign.
Re: Kingo Malkovitch#1: Jeromie vs. Hyperpape
Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 8:14 am
by hyperpape
This is a good move that I unfortunately didn't consider. I was so focused on the white group moving out into the center, I didn't think about the chance to make eyespace in sente.
Re: Kingo Malkovitch#1: Jeromie vs. Hyperpape
Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 9:45 am
by Kirby
$$Bcm45 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . X . O . W W W . | $$ | . . W , . . . X . , . . . . B X B . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . W . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , X . . . . X . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X X . . . . . . . X B . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . O . 2 . X . . . . . | $$ | . . W X . . . . . O . O . . . X . . . | $$ | . . W O X X . X . X X O . O . B . . . | $$ | . . . . O W . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm45 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . X . O . W W W . | $$ | . . W , . . . X . , . . . . B X B . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . W . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , X . . . . X . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X X . . . . . . . X # . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . O . 2 . X . . . . . | $$ | . . W X . . . . . O . O . . . X . . . | $$ | . . W O X X a X b X X @ . O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . O W . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
My initial reaction was that I thought this move worked really nicely for White because I would have to defend around a or b, but I don't think that's the case.
$$Bcm45 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . X . O . W W W . | $$ | . . W , . . . X . , . . . . B X B . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . W . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , X . . . . X . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X X . . . . . . . X B . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . O . 2 . X . . . . . | $$ | . . W X . 0 7 9 . O . O . . . X . . . | $$ | . . W O X X 6 X . X X @ . O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . O W 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm55 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . X . O . W W W . | $$ | . . W , . . . X . , . . . . B X B . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . W . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , X . . . . X . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X X . . 3 . . . . X B . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . 2 . . . O . O . X . . . . . | $$ | . . W X 1 O X X . O . O . . . X . . . | $$ | . . W O X X O X . X X @ . O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . O W O . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Sacrificing the two stones might even be better as well.
If that's right, I'll have to figure out the best move to play elsewhere. :B49: jumps to mind, but there's also plenty elsewhere, and even if there's nothing he can do immediately at a or b, I may still want to avoid giving his group a forcing move.
Re: Kingo Malkovitch#1: Jeromie vs. Hyperpape
Posted: Sun Feb 11, 2018 12:04 pm
by hyperpape
$$Bcm45 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . X . O . W W W . | $$ | . . W , . . . X . , . . . . B X B . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . W . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , X . . . . X . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X X . . . . . . . X B . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . O . 2 . X . . . . . | $$ | . . W X . . . . . O . O . . . X . . . | $$ | . . W O X X . X . X X @ . O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . O W . . . . . . . . 5 . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm45 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . W . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . X . O . W W W . | $$ | . . W , . . . X . , . . . . B X B . . | $$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . X . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . W . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . b . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , X . . . . X . . . . . X . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . g . a . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X X . . . . . . . X B . . . . . . | $$ | . . O X . . . f . O . 2 . X . . . . . | $$ | . . W X . . . e . O . O . . . X . . . | $$ | . . W O X X c X d X X @ . O . . . . . | $$ | . . . . O W . . . . . . . . 5 . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
After reading out moves at c, d, e and f, I don't think I need to be worried there. With that settled, I ended up looking hardest at a and b. I think a isn't actually that big, and b is bigger if I go for expanding/solidifying my moyo.
Late in the process, I looked at . My biggest concern is that I'm not sure how easy it is for White to undermine my corner. But when I read out the 3-3 point, it didn't seem like there's anything good for White. Maybe a kakari/submarine move would be forcing, which helps him invade the moyo.
As far as the center, I think that denying him an easy life on the side will make him want to come out near f or g. After that, I hope to continue expanding the moyo as he runs out.
Re: Kingo Malkovitch#1: Jeromie vs. Hyperpape
Posted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 10:44 am
by jeromie
Just wanted to let you know that I saw your move and will have an update in the next day or so.
. My biggest concern is that I'm not sure how easy it is for White to undermine my corner. But when I read out the 3-3 point, it didn't seem like there's anything good for White. Maybe a kakari/submarine move would be forcing, which helps him invade the moyo.