That's a move I really need to remember. It's so automatic for someone of my level to just block at S6 - after all, all the cuts are protected. I'm reminded of this funny joseki:
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . X O . . . . . . . X . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , X . . | $$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . | $$ | . . X . X . X . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . O . O O . . . . . . . . O X . | $$ | . . O O . . . X X , . . X . O O X X . | $$ | . . X X . X . . . . . . X O . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . 0 . . O X X O X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 7 6 9 . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Re: 98. Araban vs. Magicwand
Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:02 pm
by jts
daniel_the_smith wrote:@Araban
I think a move that's sente for both is called "double sente"...
(you can read this to verify, Araban)
I think what Araban is saying that even though MW will have to take gote here, MW has to play the move to deny Araban a big sente move. In which case he's using "reverse sente" right.
Re: 98. Araban vs. Magicwand
Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:03 pm
by fwiffo
This game is awesome.
Re: 98. Araban vs. Magicwand
Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:33 pm
by Jedo
fwiffo wrote:
This game is awesome.
YOU'RE WELCOME
Re: 98. Araban vs. Magicwand
Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:39 pm
by amnal
Magicwand says some things that I consider dubious, and undoubtedly has his quirks, but at times like this I think his strength and experience are very very impressive. On reflection his points about aji seem obvious (and strong!), but I doubt I would have not played the aji-keshi move in the game.
Re: 98. Araban vs. Magicwand
Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:42 pm
by topazg
amnal wrote:
Magicwand says some things that I consider dubious, and undoubtedly has his quirks, but at times like this I think his strength and experience are very very impressive. On reflection his points about aji seem obvious (and strong!), but I doubt I would have not played the aji-keshi move in the game.
I was thinking exactly the same thing. I was considering omitting that move on the right a mistake until I saw what magicwand had in mind. Then I felt rather foolish for not seeing it ... that sort of thing should be obvious somehow
Re: 98. Araban vs. Magicwand
Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:55 pm
by Aphelion
Magicwand:
I really really liked your last move and explanations. Please keep them coming.
Re: 98. Araban vs. Magicwand
Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 5:34 pm
by Puppycakes
I feel pretty good because I was thinking that magicwand should play that way in reply to araban's push. I was thinking that his push was dubious. Not that he couldn't wipe the floor with me, but when I was around a 7 kyu my 1dan friend showed me that move instead of blocking and pointed out that it doesn't have the shape flaw of allowing a peep and clamping does.
Re: 98. Araban vs. Magicwand
Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 6:41 pm
by Violence
Mmm...
We are approaching the part of the game where Solch is at his strongest, imo.
I feel like the real show is going to begin soon.
Re: 98. Araban vs. Magicwand
Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 1:31 am
by Solomon
$$Bcm41 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . X O . . . . . . . X . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , X . . | $$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , 5 . . | $$ | . . X . X . X . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . O . O O . . . . . . . . O X . | $$ | . . O O . . . X X , . . X . O O X X . | $$ | . . X X . X . . . . . . X O . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X O X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . X O . . . . . . . X . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , X . . | $$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , 5 . . | $$ | . . X . X . X . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . O . O O . . . . . . . . O X . | $$ | . . O O . . . X X , . . X . O O X X . | $$ | . . X X . X . . . . . . X O . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X O X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
It was mostly a debate between and one stone above; seeing how the situation at the bottom didn't turn out very well, I need to push to the limit.
Re: 98. Araban vs. Magicwand
Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 2:49 am
by Solomon
Just thought I'd do some reviewing over the first 45 moves, brief thoughts:
(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2] RU[Japanese]SZ[19]KM[6.50] PW[Magicwand]PB[Araban] ;B[qd] ;W[dp] ;B[qp] ;W[dd] ;B[fc] ;W[df] ;B[fq] (;W[eo] ;B[cq] ;W[cp] ;B[dq] (;W[ge]C[Seems overambitious to me.] ;B[ck] ;W[ci] ;B[ek] ;W[cm] ;B[gk] ;W[go] (;B[hp] ;W[ho] ;B[ip] ;W[ik] (;B[ei] ;W[gc] (;B[cc] ;W[dc] (;B[oc] ;W[op] ;B[mq] ;W[qq] (;B[pq] ;W[pp] (;B[or]C[Hamete; it is discussed in the book "이창호 퇴치" (http://oromall.com/goods_detail.php?goodsIdx=468).] ;W[qr] ;B[rr] ;W[qo] ;B[rp] ;W[nr] ;B[pr] ;W[nq]C[Clearly a good result for White. This is why I need to stop playing hamete.] ;B[mp] ;W[pn] ;B[ro] ;W[qm] ;B[qj]) (;B[oq] ;W[nq] ;B[np] ;W[nr] ;B[qr] ;W[rq] ;B[or] ;W[qo] ;B[mr] ;W[no] ;B[mp]C[What both of us probably expected.])) (;B[rq] ;W[pq] ;B[qn])) (;B[pj]C[I think this has better vibe now that I think about it. Seems to work well with the lower half of the board.])) (;B[dc] ;W[cc] ;B[cb]C[I think I should have just played like this to be honest. Either that or tenuki.])) (;B[hd]C[I really wanted to play this move, but it seems too dangerous.])) (;B[hq]C[I should have considered this move more, it wasn't even in my mind when I played G9 at the time, but only occured to me now.])) (;W[cj]C[I feel like this move is better, although the shape below is awkward.])) (;W[hq]C[I think something like this would have been fine for W.]))
[Chew as Mod]Edited to fix sgf-full tag[/mod]
Re: 98. Araban vs. Magicwand
Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 2:56 am
by Magicwand
$$Bcm41 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . X O . . . . . . . X . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , X 6 . | $$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , X . . | $$ | . . X . X . X . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . O . O O . . . . . . . . O X . | $$ | . . O O . . . X X , . . X . O O X X . | $$ | . . X X . X . . . . . . X O . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X O X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
[go]$$Bcm41 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . X O . . . . . . . X . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , X 6 . | $$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , X . . | $$ | . . X . X . X . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . O . O O . . . . . . . . O X . | $$ | . . O O . . . X X , . . X . O O X X . | $$ | . . X X . X . . . . . . X O . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X O X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
Re: 98. Araban vs. Magicwand
Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 5:16 am
by Kirby
Violence wrote:
Mmm...
We are approaching the part of the game where Solch is at his strongest, imo.
...
Do you simply mean the "middle game", or something more specific?
Re: 98. Araban vs. Magicwand
Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 7:47 am
by Magicwand
for obs:
if he gives me corner life aji then i will play slow and that is enough. i think 47 below is correct response for black. (what do i know..i am only 4 dan)
$$Bcm41 Prisoner Count: B-0 W-0 $$ --------------------------------------- $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . X O . X O . . . . . 8 . X . . . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , X 6 . | $$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . 7 . . | $$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , X . . | $$ | . . X . X . X . O . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . | $$ | . . . . O . O O . . . . . . . . O X . | $$ | . . O O . . . X X , . . X . O O X X . | $$ | . . X X . X . . . . . . X O . X O . . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X X O X . | $$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | $$ ---------------------------------------
after its explained to me, but it feel weird and unnatural.
and one stone above; seeing how the situation at the bottom didn't turn out very well, I need to push to the limit.