Life In 19x19

The black stones in upper right corner look thin.

I'll have to admit that I'm not comfortable with white position (I would have played differently earlier definitely), but I thought it might be a good learning experience, so I joined. Also, 26 sure is not the point to vary, at least we now have one nice corner ourselves.

What makes me uncomfortable are the top corners. On left, black has ideal formation after 27, and on right the point A makes nice box shape. Additionally, it's quite easy to pressure the two stones in the top to increase these corners. Both top corners require care to handle, and I don't have much experience with these enclosure + extension shapes, sorry lil' bro... If open book, I'll definitely do a refresher on these shapes and invasion points.

I consider B in response to to 27 to be quite suicidal for us - at least on initial glance, I reserve the right to chance my opinion. Too good shapes for black, not enough for us. Something at top seems needed. Perhaps strenghten the two stones with move against right, and then some action on left.

Never played this kind of malkovich before. Have to take care to not change things too much either - e.g. Probes seem risky as there is no quarantee lil'bro has the same idea on when to tenuki...

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Bcm21
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 7 . . . . . . . . . . . a . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , b . . . . , . . . . 6 , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

It is gote. I smell three stones coming our way.

What is he going to use for a follow up?

This?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 6 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 1 5 . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O 3 X 7 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . 8 . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Maybe this?

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 2 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Or this???

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 2 . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

It looks like gote to me.

Of course, if opposing big brother approves, and my younger brother answers, it is going to cost US three stones. But it will be worth it.

28 encourages black to fix the three point jump (minus), and strenghtens the 2 white stones on top (plus). If the plan is to press/invade bottom severely enough next, might be ok? I personally would prefer to poke top left with 28, and after that hopefully either the 2 white stones at top are strengtened, or the top left sufficiently reduced, that e.g. R15 would be possible.

Firstly, I decided answering with E10 wasn't a good idea because it felt overconcentrated. It would defend my investment on the side, but there's not much there anyway and it's not very good as an expansion, so I dismissed it.

That left me wanting to do something pro-active to stop black making nice positions with P12/E12. As I said before, the left hand one is bigger for black, so I was tempted to cap it straight away because I think it's good for me if he tries to poke through the elephant eye:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wcm1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O 4 . 3 . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

But there's no need for him to do that straight away, and I don't want to be left worrying about that weakness, so I thought it would be better to play the cap on the other side where I have support from P10.

My plan from here depends on how he replies:

If he responds with something defensive on the third or fourth line I'll probably consider view P12 as having done it's job as a reduction and go back and play E12.

If he tenukis I think I may have some strong follow up's, but I'm tempted just to push him low in sente and build influence to support the K17 group and for a reduction of the top left.

If he attaches at P13 I will have to do some serious reading.

...with gritted teeth, since I don't want to change two moves in a row, and e12 after this is very bad, this is just not so good, and aji keshi. Could not find a good move here which would stop lil bro from playing his proposed e12 next.

Personally I would now play some probe-like attachment in either top corner, but I'm not sure the continuations wouldn't turn into a mess of corrections from both sides, which does not appeal. Don't want to take control of the game like that, better to try to improve little brothers plans. Btw, if I wanted to suppport k17 group, n15 seems much better than this p12.

Problem with e12, and proposed continuation by Splatted: black has a large corner he would like to build. White already has weak group on top. E12 & cont. would create another floating target on the other side.

TIM82 wrote:Approved....

W can improve on one of Joaz's variations

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 2 . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

3 seems to be an improvement. If B plays the same 4, W moves out. W is reasonably strong and B's group is weak with a lot of aji against the corner.

Or if B changes 4:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X 6 7 . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . 5 X 8 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . 9 . 3 . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 . 1 . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

B can move out easily, and again W is weak.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Bc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . c . b . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . a . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . g . . . . . . . . . W . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O f . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . d . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . e . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . . . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

So these are a few moves I'm thinking about. I'm not sure that white's cap is sente, as I don't see a single move that causes huge problems in the corner, though white can certainly reduce. If it does, then a move like A or B would seem to be best. That said, I'm overcome with an urge to start the fighting already. Move C looks to stabilize the corner more as white can't break in to the corner right away and it puts pressure on the topside group while cutting. White also tenukied black's approach at C12, so black could look to take advantage of this.

I think I am going to play B to induce white C and then take a play on the left side.

Younger brother's move is too small and slow. White could reply like this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Bcm21
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . X . O . . O . X . . . . |
$$ | . . X , X . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . B . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . O . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . . . . . , . . . . O , O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O . . . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . O X O . X . . . X . a . X . O . . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

...which is big and sente, threatening to play 'a'.

The lower left corner has lots of potential for both sides. Whoever moves out first starts developing a moyo.