Life In 19x19

You really expected 3-3 attachment? c9 is quite unusual, do you play it often? Do your opponents usually 3-3 in response? Would you if in his position? I like his knight's move.

I don't believe anyone has ever even played this pincer against me. If they have I do not remember. From my understanding this pincer is usually regarded as being inferior nowadays. However, yes, many of my opponents play the attachment when I play it.

I'm not sure if I've ever played this in a situation where my opponent had a star point stone on the other side. I could see how this move would be good given that.

Since whte touched my stone this area became urgent. Playing the 'standard' joseki feels straight forward as it seems to fit well with my other stones. Atfer the possible sequence below I have several options (a)-(e) which will be difficult to decide. Invading at (b) is of course tempting, however playing on the 'junction line' (a) may be a better option. Maybe even a shoulder hit on works. (d) would take cash in the corner and threaten (f). Finally, (e) would solidify the position but would be also most passive. Fortunately, I do not have to decide just now...

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[go]$$Wcm10
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . d . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . f . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . 1 . . . . . . . . c . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . b . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . 3 . a . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 6 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . e . . |
$$ | . . 7 , . 4 . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . 9 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]

This is what I expected black would play after the knight's move. I thought the end result of this 5-4 joseki would look good for me. I'm still comfortable with it - I am undercutting the bottom and have a stone in place already to reduce black's potential on the left. Both of those are good things. However, there is a move that I did not consider until now...

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[go]$$Wcm10
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . b . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . O . a . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X B . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O B . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . B . . . B . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]

Looking at the position, I could see how 'a' would be a fantastic move for black. It is right where I want to play, but, given the high stones black has in the area, this move would also be good for schawipp. It is the kind of move that I would be happy to see if I was playing as black in this game. And probably a move I would take quickly.

Black playing here would be quite disheartening. Still, I'd want to invade on the right. As big as that move might be, I don't believe it is as big as getting into that corner. My goal then would be to play a reduction sequence and then jump back to defend myself at 'b.' That said, I can't just tenuki from a situation on the right without being in a decent position.

Yes, the long knight could be cut later, but it would be a tough fight if it comes to that. I must not let that become necessary.

Black playing there would certainly be painful...

As white I wouldn't fear the e9 cap as it looks a bit soft to me, pincer around c12 could be a more powerful way to use the thickness below (attack rather than try to surround centre territory).

I prefer the variation with solid connection. Otherwise, white can get an extra peep at E6 later, which may cause complications at the wrong time. White most likely replies at F2 (attach at F3 seems only second-best...) and gets 15 points. As mentioned before it will then be tricky to chose the next followup...

Well, let's see what my opponent does. I talked quite a bit about my feelings at this point in the previous tag. I considered playing tenuki here, but the result would be far worse. Black could lock me out of the bottom in sente and that is unacceptable. I still think this is my best move, even if I don't like what might happen next.

A deep invasion doesn't look convincing:

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[go]$$Bcm19 The invasion feels somewhat lonely...
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . 1 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , 4 . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . X . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]

Another variation: Since the lower b stones are not yet a solid wall, the last w move is on a shape point and threatens a cut (at a). I would need to protect the cut in bad shape while w will live and neutralize a big part of my influence.

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[go]$$Bcm19
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 1 . 3 . 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . O . 2 . 4 . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X . 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , a X . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]

If I play a purely defensive move, the w response around E9 or F9 would be really big

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[go]$$Bcm19
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | ? ? ? O ? ? ? ? . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | ? ? ? ? ? ? ? . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | ? ? ? ? ? ? . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | ? ? ? ? ? . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . O . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . X . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]

Therefore, if the game would develop like the following, it should not be too bad. However I should keep in mind that I have identified (a) as a potentially weak spot (= a move where w can potentially play in sente), which may eventually need to be fixed.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Bcm19
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . O . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X . a . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . X . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]

It is as I feared.

The question now is whether to tenuki or respond locally. Now that this situation is real, tenuki looks harder, but that could just be my own fears talking.

I need to think about this...

Well, this move took a lot of thought, but I think it's the one I need here. I'm glad I spent another day on it - I was going to tenuki last night.

There was a lot of considerations, but my final decision came as a result of a sort of tewari analysis. I asked the quesiton: if black had pincered instead of capping, would I tenuki?

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[go]$$Wcm20
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . B . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . O . C . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . X . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]

The answer there was - no, I wouldn't. But, if I tenuki from here, a move like a pincer is likely to be the response. And then I don't have the option to jump out - or really fight well. I couldn't find a variation I liked following a pincer here.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wcm1 Marked stones are moves 11 and 12.
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . B . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . 6 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 1 3 4 8 . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . O . X 7 0 . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . 9 W . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . O , . X . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]

I suppose we might play something like this? But that looks really nice for black.

And I couldn't find any suitable punishment against black's 3-4 stone from a tenuki. 5-4 joseki just don't offer enough compensation. Especially when black has support stones on either side.

My last thought: looking at the position locally, I think this is a bit bettter for white. This move removes a fair amount of aji from my double-wing formation. That said, from a global perspective, I really like black's move. It seems to fit with all the stones black has already played - something I strive to do in my games. So while I may have had a slight win locally, I think black received just compensation on a global perspective.

The question now is: will black play some type of enclosure, or continue with a Chinese fuseki move like a, b, or c? Personally, I like either b or c here. We'll see what schawipp decides.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$Wcm20
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . . . c . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . X . . . X . . b a . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]

Bill Spight wrote:

$$B
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . W . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . X . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------

Click Here To Show Diagram Code

[go]$$B
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . O . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . W . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . O . X . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O , . X . . . X . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]

This keima was also my first feeling.
Globally, the - exchange seems good for ?

Thanks. I cannot evaluate it.