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which diagram format do you like better?

https://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?t=13820

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Re:

Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 3:56 am
by Cassandra
EdLee wrote:Hi Jhyn, (off topic)
to spit in the soup (French expression)
Do you think it's similar to...
  • Look a gift horse in the mouth ;
    -- or --
  • Splittng hairs ;
Or something else ? Just curious. :)
This idiom is also available in German ...

Its meaning is "to thwart someone's plans", "to spoil someone something".

Probably it might be similar to "to oversalt the soup" (don't know whether this idiom is available in English), i.e. "to make the soup uneatable".

Re: Re:

Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 4:06 am
by Shenoute
Cassandra wrote:
EdLee wrote:Hi Jhyn, (off topic)
to spit in the soup (French expression)
Do you think it's similar to...
  • Look a gift horse in the mouth ;
    -- or --
  • Splittng hairs ;
Or something else ? Just curious. :)
This idiom is also available in German ...

Its meaning is "to thwart someone's plans", "to spoil someone something".

Probably it might be similar to "to oversalt the soup" (don't know whether this idiom is available in English), i.e. "to make the soup uneatable".
I don't think they are the same thing. "To spit in the soup" ("cracher dans la soupe") means "to be ungrateful".

The thing with the horse mentioned by Edlee seems closer in meaning. Actually in French there is a saying that looks similar, "A cheval donné, on ne regarde pas les dents", more or less "when someone gives you a horse, you don't check its teeth".

Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 4:07 am
by EdLee
Hi Cassandra,
I'm reminded of "to throw cold water on <someone or something>", but that's slightly different. Thanks.
Hi Shenoute,
"A cheval donné, on ne regarde pas les dents"
This seems to be of the same orgin as the English version:
the reason to look into a horse's mouth is to check the teeth --
(to check the health or pedigree, etc. ?) -- so the meaning seems identical. :)
Thanks.

Re: Re:

Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 4:22 am
by Cassandra
Shenoute wrote:
I don't think they are the same thing. "To spit in the soup" ("cracher dans la soupe") means "to be ungrateful".

The thing with the horse mentioned by Edlee seems closer in meaning. Actually in French there is a saying that looks similar, "A cheval donné, on ne regarde pas les dents", more or less "when someone gives you a horse, you don't check its teeth".
Hi, Shenoute,

I see ...
So the French idiom is similar to the German one "to bite the hand that feeds you".

The difference might be whether you are spitting in your own soup (French) or in someone else's (German) ;-)

Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 4:25 am
by EdLee
Hi Cassandra,
the German one "to bite the hand that feeds you".
This one is identical to the English version. :)

Re: which diagram format do you like better?

Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 6:05 am
by Jhyn
Kirby wrote:Are the numbers and letters the main readability problem? Anything else that Charlie didn't mention?
It is hard to explain but my main issue is that the four images look really blurry to me, especially the lines (and everything in option 4). They are hard to focus on, if you see what I mean. Maybe it comes from the screenshot?
EdLee wrote:Hi Jhyn, (off topic)
Sorry that I kinda derailed the thread with my French expressions :lol:

I would say it's really close in meaning to "Look a gift horse in the mouth". You are offered some soup to survive (for your benefit) and you spit in it to show it's not good enough. It's close to "Biting the hand that feeds you", but a bit softer; a feeling of ungratefulness rather that outright treason.

Re: which diagram format do you like better?

Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 7:53 am
by hyperpape
I think one difference that might be Jhyn's issue is that (without measuring), the lines in the old diagrams look like they're a single black pixel. On the new diagrams, they look like they might be two grey pixels, or maybe grey with anti-aliasing?

I voted for one, but I think it could be improved by making the lines crisper. It may be mere familiarity, but I had no aesthetic complaints with the old diagrams, so a technical upgrade that leaves the look the same would make me happy.

Re: which diagram format do you like better?

Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 9:01 am
by Kirby
Well, there are two reasons I started doing this:
1.) I needed something to take my mind off of other stuff going on in my life.
2.) I personally felt that the "old" format looked old-fashioned - purely an aesthetic concern.

It may very well be that I'm in the minority for #2 - it would seem that people are generally preferring the look of the old diagrams.

If that's the case, I don't think that a new implementation like the one I prototyped really buys us any real technical improvement, so it's probably not worth changing.

I'm totally fine if that's the case, since this was mainly started as a means to pass time.

Re: which diagram format do you like better?

Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 9:54 am
by Monadology
Would it be possible to get examples with actual board positions set up (so we can see how they would look 'in the wild')?

Re: which diagram format do you like better?

Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 10:17 am
by Bill Spight
You may have mainly been passing the time, but thank you for your efforts, Kirby. :D Developing and presenting different options to our members and getting feedback is well worth the effort, even if we do not change the format. Advise and consent, as they say. :)

Re: which diagram format do you like better?

Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 10:21 am
by Kirby
Monadology wrote:Would it be possible to get examples with actual board positions set up (so we can see how they would look 'in the wild')?
You can use the tags yourself if you want to play with it. Just use the same tags I had in my original post ("go-beta", "go-beta2", "go-beta3"). The prototype isn't fully functional though, so you may find bugs.

If you don't want to make an actual post, previewing a post still renders the diagrams.

I haven't done anything further to make the images crisper or more readable. I don't feel that there is a reason to do this if a new color scheme or design isn't preferred to the existing diagrams.

Re: which diagram format do you like better?

Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 10:23 am
by Kirby
Bill Spight wrote:You may have mainly been passing the time, but thank you for your efforts, Kirby. :D Developing and presenting different options to our members and getting feedback is well worth the effort, even if we do not change the format. Advise and consent, as they say. :)
Thanks, Bill. I agree :-)

Re: which diagram format do you like better?

Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 10:39 am
by Monadology
[go-beta]$$Bcm61 Prisoners: :b2:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X . X 1 2 , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . O . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . X . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go-beta]

[go-beta2]$$Bcm61 Prisoners: :b2:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X . X 1 2 , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . O . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . X . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go-beta2]

[go-beta3]$$Bcm61 Prisoners: :b2:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X . X 1 2 , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . O . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . X . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go-beta3]

[go-beta4]$$Bcm61 Prisoners: :b2:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O . . . . X O . X . . . , X O . |
$$ | . . O O X X . . X O . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . O . . O X . . . . O . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O O X . O O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X X X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . O . . O . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X X . X 1 2 , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . O O O O . . O . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . X . . . O . . O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . O . X . X . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . X . . . X . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go-beta4]

For those who want the reference (used the diagram from Kirby's prior thread)

Re: which diagram format do you like better?

Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 12:49 pm
by Bonobo
I really, really, really like #2!

<edit>
Ideally, coloring scheme would be a user (i.e. reader) preference.

That way all such diagrams would use the color scheme a user/reader prefers, no matter which color the post/comment author prefers … but I have no idea whether such a thing would be possible (or worth investing time into, of course).
</edit>


<edit 2>
Maybe even with options here:
• always use the color scheme the author has edited the diagram in
• always have the user’s preferred color scheme override the author’s
</edit 2>

Re: which diagram format do you like better?

Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 2:00 pm
by Kirby
Interesting idea, Bonobo. We already have the option for users to select themes. I think this is certainly possible to extend such that users can see the format they want (after logging in).
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