Life In 19x19

I like laptop keyboards, because they have short action. Mine has a slight curve, for a quite comfortable hand position:



I have never felt the need to switch to a dvorak or colemak layout. I only made some minor adjustments, such as switching left control and caps lock (important for me) and making standard accents available as both dead and non-dead keys. It is no space cadet yet...

daniel_the_smith wrote:After a number of years I got what I really wanted:

I reviewed the Kineses a number of years ago. My two complaints are that it's way too big, and that the action on the keys is (was) very stiff. It's also overpriced.

BTW, I use a Dvorak layout too; I just find that with less movement on the keys, I don't need an ergo shape keyboard.

Harleqin wrote:I like laptop keyboards, because they have short action. Mine has a slight curve, for a quite comfortable hand position:

I have never felt the need to switch to a dvorak or colemak layout. I only made some minor adjustments, such as switching left control and caps lock (important for me) and making standard accents available as both dead and non-dead keys. It is no space cadet yet...

Is that your computer? Why do you leave the stickers on?

Re Dvorak: it's of no use unless you touch-type.

re: dvorak:

I would say there's no point in learning it unless you *don't* already touch type; it's easier to learn than Qwerty and you won't be able to transfer your bad habits over. Or if you're getting RSI, but switch keyboards and mice before you go to all the effort.

I was having issues with my wrists. I literally could not type without pain.
Got this Kineses Freestyle w/ 20 inch seperation. Now all is A-okay.



If you get one for yourself, do not let even a drop of water near it. It's very sensitive to water/liquids.

Pedantic trivia warning.

For those of you talking about Dovorak, I'll offer the following trivia. The standard korean keyboard layout is seperated, consonants on the left, vowles on the right. The rules of the language nearly enforce a consonant-vowel-consonant pattern (with exceptions, of course). I still use qwerty when typing roman characters, but I can't type in korean without thinking of Dovorak.

More fun trivia. The first qwerty keyboard was on a product marketed as the typewritter. As a marketing gimic, all the letters in the word typewritter are on the top row of letters... Think you haven't used a typewritter in years? think again.

I have a 15 year old Dell keyboard. I really like the feel so I've carried it from one computer to the next over the years. It's the kind that has mechanical switches - I find they give better feel than a modern keyboard. A bunch of the labels on the keys have gotten worn off, but that's OK, I use the Dvorak layout so the labels are pretty meaningless to me anyway.

kirkmc wrote:I reviewed the Kineses a number of years ago. My two complaints are that it's way too big, and that the action on the keys is (was) very stiff. It's also overpriced.

BTW, I use a Dvorak layout too; I just find that with less movement on the keys, I don't need an ergo shape keyboard.

I was fine on just dvorak, too, for a while, but the last nanowrimo combined with full-time programming convinced me to spend the money. Programming uses a lot of keys that are traditionally hit by the right pinky. I remapped my kinesis (yes, overpriced, keys seem ok to me, and size shouldn't be a problem if you put your trackpad in the middle) to spread them out a little.

A friend of mine went through a whole slew of keyboards (at significant expense considering one was a Topre Realforce) looking for a solution to his RSI. The Kinesis Freestyle is the first one that worked out for him.

daniel_the_smith wrote:re: dvorak:

I would say there's no point in learning it unless you *don't* already touch type; it's easier to learn than Qwerty and you won't be able to transfer your bad habits over. Or if you're getting RSI, but switch keyboards and mice before you go to all the effort.

If you're just typing with two or four fingers, there's no gain. If you touch type - either before or after learning Dvorak - then there is gain. But for most people who don't touch type and will never learn, I think it's a waste of time.

I use a Unicomp "Customizer 101" I bought new a few years ago. The keyboard is heavy enough to stun an ox. I love the feel of the buckling spring keys and the CLACK they make as I type. It's a PS/2 keyboard, but I have not had any trouble using a USB adapter. It's old school, but so am I .

fwiffo wrote:I use a Filco Majestouch tenkeyless with Cherry MX Brown switches, which is why I immediately recognized this:

Where were you a few months ago? I searched on the usual sites (Amazon, Newegg) for a compact keyboard or a regular/smallish kb without a tenkey, and all I found were really crappy overpriced options that were fundamentally flawed in some way or another (like this one with the most absurdly annoying 'enter' shape and placement and '/' placement ever).

This certainly doesn't offer a solution for "overpriced" but "crappy" seems to be taken care of. I will have to ponder.

kirkmc wrote:

daniel_the_smith wrote:re: dvorak:

I would say there's no point in learning it unless you *don't* already touch type; it's easier to learn than Qwerty and you won't be able to transfer your bad habits over. Or if you're getting RSI, but switch keyboards and mice before you go to all the effort.

If you're just typing with two or four fingers, there's no gain. If you touch type - either before or after learning Dvorak - then there is gain. But for most people who don't touch type and will never learn, I think it's a waste of time.

Is it really true that most people don't touch type? I mean, maybe most 50 year olds don't, but I'd suspect most 20 somethings do.

I prefer standard, I never bothered to learn emacs because vi is what exists everywhere so if I can do it in vi it makes everything so much easier.
It's no fun editing on a firewall where no programs can be installed if you cannot handle vi
(of course if you're doing more advanced things, it's different, but for me it's always been technical)

I hate the windows key, separable keyboards and other abominations. I still use my dell keyboard from 1995 or so, like wms I move it from one PC to another.

The only improvement I can think of is a tab key at the num pad.

Caps is pretty useless, but not as useless as the windows key, and ¨ and ^ are less usefull than eg the norwegian/danish ae or crossed over o (ö) for me.

½ is a key that I seriously boubt any sober person would put on a keyboard btw.

OK so I have some other ideas of improvements...
Also the space tab is too big, buut I generally like the "standard" keyboard, the only real bother is the lack of a tab key on the num pad

/Mats
/Mats

CSamurai wrote:What every geek wants.

Why would you want a keyboard with LEDs on the keys, do you look at your keyboard or something?


About Dvorak - I used it for over 5 years and just recently switched to qwerty. I think it's overrated: the advantages of marginally faster and more comfortable typing will not outweigh the disadvantages of using something nobody else does.

palapiku wrote:

CSamurai wrote:What every geek wants.

Why would you want a keyboard with LEDs on the keys, do you look at your keyboard or something?

What, you've never wanted your keyboard to display randomly changing images as you type?

I have touchtyped for over 15 years now, but having 113 programable, undetermined displays is way more awesome than the keyboard you dovorak users should buy.