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Re: #185 EdLee vs. The Intrepid: The Swords
Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 2:18 am
by The Intrepid
$$B
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$B
EdLee made the high kakari and not the low one, just as I expected him to. My preparation is paying dividends!
Of course, I do not know which of the two choices was stronger. In fact, it is entirely possible that the high kakari is objectively better. We'd need to ask a professional about this. However, I personally would have played the low kakari, expecting the following:
$$Wcm6
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wcm6Is this better than what will happen in the game? Time will tell.
Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 2:26 am
by EdLee
For beginners. First feeling is the very natural hane-block
(but it's not the only local joseki move):
$$B
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$B$$B
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$B
Because of recent adventures, all my Go books, including Ishida and Takao, are buried in a box somewhere.
(Not as bad as the final scene in Indiana Jones, though.) I'll have to find that box... tomorrow.
Re: #185 EdLee vs. The Intrepid: The Swords
Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 4:02 am
by The Intrepid
$$B
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$B
In addition to
, EdLee could have considered one of the following:
$$Wc
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wcor
$$Wc
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$WcEither of these choices could have led to massive complications.
Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 4:16 am
by EdLee
$$
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$
Joseki move, I think.
(After I already played
, I found my Ishida and Takao, and found out
is not the only joseki move here.)
Re: #185 EdLee vs. The Intrepid: The Swords
Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 4:25 am
by The Intrepid
Here I'll need to think for a while. I have many choices, including these:
$$
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Edit:
I should add that EdLee could have considered playing this, as well:
$$Wc
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$WcIncidentally, the following would be a mistake for Black:
$$Bc
= tenuki
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O 2 . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O O X X 1 6 |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O 5 . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . X . 4 . . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . X . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bc
Re: #185 EdLee vs. The Intrepid: The Swords
Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:55 am
by The Intrepid
Man, deciding how to play here is hard!
Moreover, the more I look at the various possibilities, the more I become convinced a massive, hugely complicated fight is unavoidable--an outcome which runs counter to my intended way of playing this game. Hmm, maybe I should just go for the complications.
Anyhow, it looks like just about any visually reasonable move is playable here. Nevertheless, I think I'll play one of the following two moves:
$$
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$"a" is somewhat of a probe, giving White the choice of whether to pincer (which I believe to be the better option) or not. The close-low
pincer is probably best, although Q11 cannot be bad either. After
, I would again end up with a wide choice of moves (including c though g):
$$Bc
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$BcBy contrast, playing "b" more or less forces the following sequence (although
can be different):
$$
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$This would lead to a big moyo vs. big moyo fight. Various attempts at invasion or reduction would be coming next, so my playing at "a" could end up being unavoidable, anyway.
Re: #185 EdLee vs. The Intrepid: The Swords
Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 1:53 am
by The Intrepid
$$Bm11
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bm11
Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 2:01 am
by EdLee
For beginners. First feeling: reply (a) direction, or pincer (b) direction?
Probably mood, but will think of the continuations...
$$
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$
Re: #185 EdLee vs. The Intrepid: The Swords
Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 2:37 pm
by The Intrepid
Re: #185 EdLee vs. The Intrepid: The Swords
Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 2:47 pm
by emeraldemon
Not for players:
Here's a pro game with a similar shape:
http://igokisen.web.fc2.com/wr/12lgf1.sgf
The move order is different here, but if EdLee plays the one space pincer it could transition into this shape.
Re: #185 EdLee vs. The Intrepid: The Swords
Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 3:02 pm
by The Intrepid
I've done some additional searching regarding the shape of Black's first three stones. The closest game I could find was Takagawa Kaku (W) vs. Kitani Minoru (B) (July 3, 1959):
$$Bc
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bc$$Wcm6
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wcm6This led to a close game where White won by the smallest of margins (0.5 of a point).
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 10:33 am
by EdLee
Re: #185 EdLee vs. The Intrepid: The Swords
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:41 pm
by Uberdude
Re: #185 EdLee vs. The Intrepid: The Swords
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:24 pm
by The Intrepid
Uberdude made a post. Yes! Achievement unlocked.
In real life, you know you've made it big when they name a road, a school, a disease, or a city after you. Online, it is things like this that tell a person he's arrived. Now, we need Magicwand to make a post, and the game will advance to the next level.
On a separate note, EdLee is thinking hard. I don't blame him. His next move could determine the character of the game. He is probably trying to figure out how to best thwart the various plans I could choose. One such plan is for me to try to get a stable group on the right side (preventing White from getting much territory there) and then build my own territory on the bottom. To illustrate, if EdLee did nothing but pass, I would not mind getting the following two moves in:
$$Bc
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bc
Re: #185 EdLee vs. The Intrepid: The Swords
Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 8:30 pm
by The Intrepid
EdLee must be busy at work. Anyhow, I thought I would titillate the masses by showing that I intend to play a knight's jump in response to a close-low pincer. A relatively rare move, to be sure, but one that is very enterprising, from what I can tell.
$$Wc
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wc
Of course, I do not know which of the two choices was stronger. In fact, it is entirely possible that the high kakari is objectively better. We'd need to ask a professional about this. However, I personally would have played the low kakari, expecting the following:
(but it's not the only local joseki move):
, EdLee could have considered one of the following:
, I found my Ishida and Takao, and found out 
= tenuki
Moreover, the more I look at the various possibilities, the more I become convinced a massive, hugely complicated fight is unavoidable--an outcome which runs counter to my intended way of playing this game. Hmm, maybe I should just go for the complications. 
pincer is probably best, although Q11 cannot be bad either. After 
In real life, you know you've made it big when they name a road, a school, a disease, or a city after you. Online, it is things like this that tell a person he's arrived. Now, we need Magicwand to make a post, and the game will advance to the next level. 