Page 15 of 20

Re: 133. Magicwand vs. Kirby

Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 9:27 am
by emeraldemon
I always wonder when I see a post like this in malkovich: 3 diagrams of variations for a move you didn't select, then one "I like this move" diagram with no variations. Did Kirby spend as much time thinking about the move he picked as the move he rejected?

In my own over-the-board play, I've noticed I will sometimes spend some time reading at a point, decide it doesn't work, then just play somewhere else without really studying it because of frustration or fatigue or "oh this looks good I'll try it". I wonder if this could be something similar.

Re: 133. Magicwand vs. Kirby

Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 1:27 pm
by Kirby
I'll talk a little bit more about the move that I selected. I think that it is a simple response to his move, which guarantees that I do not have to worry about life in this area. The only white response that I have to even really think about is this one:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm161 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . O X . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O , . . O . O , X . . O . X X X . |
$$ | . X W X X X . O X O X O O X X . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . X O X O . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X X O . O . . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . . O . O X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . O . . X O X . O X O O . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . X X X O O O O X X O |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O O X O X X X X . X X O |
$$ | . . O O . . . O X O X X . X . . X O O |
$$ | . . O X . . . O X O O O O O X X X O . |
$$ | . X X . . . . O X X X X O O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O , . O X O X X O . . |
$$ | . . X O . O . O X X X X X O X X O O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O O O O O X . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


But that response can be met with this:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm161 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . O X . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . B O , . . O . O , X . . O . X X X . |
$$ | . X W X X X . O X O X O O X X . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . X O X O . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X X O . O . . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . . O . O X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . O . . X O X . O X O O . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . X X X O O O O X X O |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O O X O X X X X . X X O |
$$ | . . O O . . . O X O X X . X . . X O O |
$$ | . . O X . . . O X O O O O O X X X O . |
$$ | . X X . . . . O X X X X O O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O , . O X O X X O . . |
$$ | . . X O . O . O X X X X X O X X O O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O O O O O X . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Easy as pie. That is, if pie is easy.

Re: 133. Magicwand vs. Kirby

Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 7:38 pm
by Magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm161 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . O X . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O , . . O . O , X . . O . X X X . |
$$ | . X 7 X X X . O X O X O O X X . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . X O X O . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X X O . O . . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . . O . O X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . O . . X O X . O X O O . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . X X X O O O O X X O |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O O X O X X X X . X X O |
$$ | . . O O . . . O X O X X . X . . X O O |
$$ | . . O X . . . O X O O O O O X X X O . |
$$ | . X X . . . . O X X X X O O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O , . O X O X X O . . |
$$ | . . X O . O . O X X X X X O X X O O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O O O O O X . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: 133. Magicwand vs. Kirby

Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:48 am
by Kirby
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm161 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . O X . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . 8 O , . . O . O , X . . O . X X X . |
$$ | . X O X X X . O X O X O O X X . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . X O X O . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X X O . O . . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . . O . O X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . O . . X O X . O X O O . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . X X X O O O O X X O |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O O X O X X X X . X X O |
$$ | . . O O . . . O X O X X . X . . X O O |
$$ | . . O X . . . O X O O O O O X X X O . |
$$ | . X X . . . . O X X X X O O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O , . O X O X X O . . |
$$ | . . X O . O . O X X X X X O X X O O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O O O O O X . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: 133. Magicwand vs. Kirby

Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:58 am
by Magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm161 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . O X . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O , . . O . O , X . . O . X X X . |
$$ | . X O X X X . O X O X O O X X . X O . |
$$ | . . 9 . O . X . . . X O X O . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X X O . O . . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . . O . O X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . O . . X O X . O X O O . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . X X X O O O O X X O |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O O X O X X X X . X X O |
$$ | . . O O . . . O X O X X . X . . X O O |
$$ | . . O X . . . O X O O O O O X X X O . |
$$ | . X X . . . . O X X X X O O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O , . O X O X X O . . |
$$ | . . X O . O . O X X X X X O X X O O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O O O O O X . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: 133. Magicwand vs. Kirby

Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 6:52 am
by Kirby
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm161 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . O X . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O 0 . . O . O , X . . O . X X X . |
$$ | . X O X X X . O X O X O O X X . X O . |
$$ | . . O . O . X . . . X O X O . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X X O . O . . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . . O . O X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . O . . X O X . O X O O . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . X X X O O O O X X O |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O O X O X X X X . X X O |
$$ | . . O O . . . O X O X X . X . . X O O |
$$ | . . O X . . . O X O O O O O X X X O . |
$$ | . X X . . . . O X X X X O O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O , . O X O X X O . . |
$$ | . . X O . O . O X X X X X O X X O O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O O O O O X . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: 133. Magicwand vs. Kirby

Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 8:36 am
by Magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm171 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 1 . . . . . . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . O X . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O X . . O . O , X . . O . X X X . |
$$ | . X O X X X . O X O X O O X X . X O . |
$$ | . . O . O . X . . . X O X O . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X X O . O . . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . . O . O X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . O . . X O X . O X O O . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . X X X O O O O X X O |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O O X O X X X X . X X O |
$$ | . . O O . . . O X O X X . X . . X O O |
$$ | . . O X . . . O X O O O O O X X X O . |
$$ | . X X . . . . O X X X X O O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O , . O X O X X O . . |
$$ | . . X O . O . O X X X X X O X X O O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O O O O O X . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

i think i am successful :) very satisfied.

Re: 133. Magicwand vs. Kirby

Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 8:43 am
by Kirby
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm171 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 2 . . O . . . . . . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . O X . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O X . . O . O , X . . O . X X X . |
$$ | . X O X X X . O X O X O O X X . X O . |
$$ | . . O . O . X . . . X O X O . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X X O . O . . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . . O . O X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . O . . X O X . O X O O . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . X X X O O O O X X O |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O O X O X X X X . X X O |
$$ | . . O O . . . O X O X X . X . . X O O |
$$ | . . O X . . . O X O O O O O X X X O . |
$$ | . X X . . . . O X X X X O O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O , . O X O X X O . . |
$$ | . . X O . O . O X X X X X O X X O O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O O O O O X . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Just waiting for a chance to tenuki.

Re: 133. Magicwand vs. Kirby

Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 8:49 am
by Chew Terr
Kirby:
May I ask why here instead of the obvious D18? Am I missing some severe threat? All I see is B18 (possibly after D19) but I have a hard time convincing myself that this move is necessary. Did you have a specific sequence you feared?

Re: 133. Magicwand vs. Kirby

Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 8:56 am
by Magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm171 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . O . . . . . . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . O X 3 . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O X . . O . O , X . . O . X X X . |
$$ | . X O X X X . O X O X O O X X . X O . |
$$ | . . O . O . X . . . X O X O . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X X O . O . . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . . O . O X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . O . . X O X . O X O O . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . X X X O O O O X X O |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O O X O X X X X . X X O |
$$ | . . O O . . . O X O X X . X . . X O O |
$$ | . . O X . . . O X O O O O O X X X O . |
$$ | . X X . . . . O X X X X O O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O , . O X O X X O . . |
$$ | . . X O . O . O X X X X X O X X O O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O O O O O X . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

if he can win then his move is good..but i think it might bite his aXX later.

Re: 133. Magicwand vs. Kirby

Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 11:15 am
by Kirby
@Chew:
I didn't think about this too much, but my main idea is that the move just finishes the corner area. If I play the other way, white's move here is sente, I think:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm171 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . B O . . . . . . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . O X . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O X . . O . O , X . . O . X X X . |
$$ | . X O X X X . O X O X O O X X . X O . |
$$ | . W O . O . X . . . X O X O . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X X O . O . . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . . O . O X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . O . . X O X . O X O O . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . X X X O O O O X X O |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O O X O X X X X . X X O |
$$ | . . O O . . . O X O X X . X . . X O O |
$$ | . . O X . . . O X O O O O O X X X O . |
$$ | . X X . . . . O X X X X O O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O , . O X O X X O . . |
$$ | . . X O . O . O X X X X X O X X O O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O O O O O X . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm1 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . 3 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 1 . X O . . . . . . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . 2 X X O . . O X . . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O X . . O . O , X . . O . X X X . |
$$ | 5 X O X X X . O X O X O O X X . X O . |
$$ | . O O . O . X . . . X O X O . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X X O . O . . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . . O . O X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . O . . X O X . O X O O . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . X X X O O O O X X O |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O O X O X X X X . X X O |
$$ | . . O O . . . O X O X X . X . . X O O |
$$ | . . O X . . . O X O O O O O X X X O . |
$$ | . X X . . . . O X X X X O O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O , . O X O X X O . . |
$$ | . . X O . O . O X X X X X O X X O O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O O O O O X . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


With the move I played I can just "be done with it". I don't know if it's the best way to play, though.

Re: 133. Magicwand vs. Kirby

Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 11:17 am
by Kirby
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm171 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . O . . . 4 . . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . O X O . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O X . . O . O , X . . O . X X X . |
$$ | . X O X X X . O X O X O O X X . X O . |
$$ | . . O . O . X . . . X O X O . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X X O . O . . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . . O . O X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . O . . X O X . O X O O . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . X X X O O O O X X O |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O O X O X X X X . X X O |
$$ | . . O O . . . O X O X X . X . . X O O |
$$ | . . O X . . . O X O O O O O X X X O . |
$$ | . X X . . . . O X X X X O O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O , . O X O X X O . . |
$$ | . . X O . O . O X X X X X O X X O O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O O O O O X . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I'm actually quite sad, because that was the move I wanted to get. I think he is beating me in the endgame. :-(

Re: 133. Magicwand vs. Kirby

Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 11:38 am
by Magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm171 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . O . . . X . . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . O X O . . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O X . . O . O 5 X . . O . X X X . |
$$ | . X O X X X . O X O X O O X X . X O . |
$$ | . . O . O . X . . . X O X O . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X X O . O . . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . . O . O X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . O . . X O X . O X O O . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . X X X O O O O X X O |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O O X O X X X X . X X O |
$$ | . . O O . . . O X O X X . X . . X O O |
$$ | . . O X . . . O X O O O O O X X X O . |
$$ | . X X . . . . O X X X X O O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O , . O X O X X O . . |
$$ | . . X O . O . O X X X X X O X X O O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O O O O O X . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]
i dont see the purpose of extending. why?

Re: 133. Magicwand vs. Kirby

Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 11:41 am
by Kirby
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm171 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . O . . . X . . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . O X O 6 . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O X . . O . O O X . . O . X X X . |
$$ | . X O X X X . O X O X O O X X . X O . |
$$ | . . O . O . X . . . X O X O . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X X O . O . . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . . O . O X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . O . . X O X . O X O O . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . X X X O O O O X X O |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O O X O X X X X . X X O |
$$ | . . O O . . . O X O X X . X . . X O O |
$$ | . . O X . . . O X O O O O O X X X O . |
$$ | . X X . . . . O X X X X O O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O , . O X O X X O . . |
$$ | . . X O . O . O X X X X X O X X O O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O O O O O X . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: 133. Magicwand vs. Kirby

Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 12:00 pm
by Magicwand
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wcm171 Prisoner Count: B-1 W-1
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X . . O . . . X 7 . . . O X . . . . |
$$ | . . X X O . . O X O X . . . . X O . . |
$$ | . X O X . . O . O O X . . O . X X X . |
$$ | . X O X X X . O X O X O O X X . X O . |
$$ | . . O . O . X . . . X O X O . . X O . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . O X X O . O . . X O . |
$$ | . . . . O . X . . . . O . O X X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . X . O . . X O X . O X O O . |
$$ | . . O , X . . . . X X X O O O O X X O |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X O O O O X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O O X O X X X X . X X O |
$$ | . . O O . . . O X O X X . X . . X O O |
$$ | . . O X . . . O X O O O O O X X X O . |
$$ | . X X . . . . O X X X X O O O O X O . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . O , . O X O X X O . . |
$$ | . . X O . O . O X X X X X O X X O O . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . O O O O O X . X X O . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . X X . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]