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#244 Bill vs Ed

https://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?t=11002

Page 16 of 22

Re: #244 Bill vs Ed

Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2014 7:51 am
by Uberdude
Aidoneus wrote:I wish I could play both J13 AND J15!
But you can't play both, so play the better one ;-)
White is trying to separate the two marked stones, j13 does a better job of connecting them.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm96
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X O . X . . O . . X . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . B . 1 . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . O B . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . X . . . . . . X . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . X . O O . . . . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . X O O O . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , . . . X O X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . O . . . . . X O X O O . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . X . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . X X O . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X X . . . . X . . O . |
$$ | . . X X X O . O O X . . . . O X X O . |
$$ | . X O O X O . . . X . . X X X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . X O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]
Notice the bad shape of the broken elephant jump (http://senseis.xmp.net/?FourBasicShapes#toc4). (White might also simply j13 now).
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm96
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X O . X . . O . . X . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . B . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . . . 2 O X . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . X . . B . . . X . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . X . O O . . . . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . X O O O . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , . . . X O X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . O . . . . . X O X O O . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . X . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . X X O . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X X . . . . X . . O . |
$$ | . . X X X O . O O X . . . . O X X O . |
$$ | . X O O X O . . . X . . X X X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . X O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]
A few moves ago:
Uberdude wrote:If black tries to save the stick of 3 stones after white cuts I fear one or both of black's groups would die. It would be better for black to sacrifice the 3 for now and secure the top group whilst also attacking k17. Maybe white shouldn't cut but attack the whole thing (and strengthen k17 in the process).
Black is getting torn to shreds in this fighting.

Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2014 7:42 pm
by EdLee
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wm97
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X O . X . . O . . X . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . X . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . . . 1 O X . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . X . . X . . . X . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . X . O O . . . . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . X O O O . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , . . . X O X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . O . . . . . X O X O O . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . X . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . X X O . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X X . . . . X . . O . |
$$ | . . X X X O . O O X . . . . O X X O . |
$$ | . X O O X O . . . X . . X X X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . X O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]
( Local time Fri Dec 05, 2014. 10:42 am. )

Re: #244 Bill vs Ed

Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 8:35 am
by Aidoneus
I need to drink in order to watch the Chicago Bears this year!
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm98
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X O . X . . O . . X . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . X . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . . . O O X . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . X . 1 X . . . X . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . X . O O . . . . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . X O O O . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , . . . X O X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . O . . . . . X O X O O . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . X . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . X X O . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X X . . . . X . . O . |
$$ | . . X X X O . O O X . . . . O X X O . |
$$ | . X O O X O . . . X . . X X X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . X O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]
While I first thought about playing K12 or even J9, I decided to go down fighting. But I'm not sure exactly what happens if White cuts now at K13. I think that either I capture the few stones above while he extends into the center, or I connect some of my stones and capture the cutting stone at K13. I shall remain an optimist until my deck is under water. ;-)

Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 9:04 pm
by EdLee
Aidoneus wrote:I need to drink in order to watch the Chicago Bears this year!
Why ? :)




( Local time Sat Dec 6, 2014. 12:04 pm. )

Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:55 pm
by EdLee
Hi Aidoneus, photo: :)
The actual faucet trim area is a bit dark,
but otherwise, quite clean design. :)
image.jpg
image.jpg (82.97 KiB) Viewed 10429 times
( Local time Sat Dec 6, 2014. 1:55 pm. )

Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 11:12 pm
by EdLee
Hi Aidoneus, Speaking of drinks... :)

Photo:
image.jpg
image.jpg (104.6 KiB) Viewed 10464 times
( Local time Sat Dec 6, 2014. 2:12 pm. )
Photo:
Not a bad place to play Go. :)
image.jpg
image.jpg (124.06 KiB) Viewed 10462 times
( Local time Sat Dec 6, 2014. 2:23 pm. )
Photo:
Back to the food theme. :)
image.jpg
image.jpg (78.71 KiB) Viewed 10443 times
( Local time Sat Dec 6, 2014. 5:03 pm. )

Re:

Posted: Sat Dec 06, 2014 7:18 am
by Aidoneus
EdLee wrote:
Aidoneus wrote:I need to drink in order to watch the Chicago Bears this year!
Why ? :)
To anesthetize the pain of watching them lose by such large margins!

Thanks for sharing your photos. I needed a vacation from cold and dreary Northwest Indiana, even if it is just vicarious. ;-)

Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2014 7:24 pm
by EdLee
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wm99
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X O . X . . O . . X . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . X . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . . . O O X . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . X 1 X X . . . X . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . X . O O . . . . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . X O O O . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , . . . X O X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . O . . . . . X O X O O . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . X . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . X X O . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X X . . . . X . . O . |
$$ | . . X X X O . O O X . . . . O X X O . |
$$ | . X O O X O . . . X . . X X X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . X O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]
( Local time Mon Dec 08, 2014. 10:24 am. )

Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2014 8:13 pm
by EdLee
Tricky.
With this variation, I'm not sure of the global result:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X O . X . . O . . X . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . X . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . 3 1 O O X . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . X 2 X X . . . X . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . X . O O . . . . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . X O O O . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , . . . X O X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . O . . . . . X O X O O . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . X . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . X X O . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X X . . . . X . . O . |
$$ | . . X X X O . O O X . . . . O X X O . |
$$ | . X O O X O . . . X . . X X X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . X O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]
( Local time Mon Dec 08, 2014. 11:13 am. )

Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2014 8:20 pm
by EdLee
On :w57: = (a), I was not sure if B knew about :b2: .
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$W
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . . O . . X . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . X X O . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X X . . . . X . . O . |
$$ | . . X X X O . O O X . . . . O X X O . |
$$ | . X O O X O . . . X . . X X X O O . . |
$$ | . 1 . . O 2 a . . . . . . X O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]
( Local time Mon Dec 08, 2014. 11:20 am )

Re: #244 Bill vs Ed

Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2014 9:35 pm
by Aidoneus
Maybe I'm delirious--I've had a cold/flu for the last three days--but it seems like you set a trap for me, and I'm not falling into it! :lol:

Then again, maybe the whiskey I'm drinking to knock me out for the night has me seeing phantoms...
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm100
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X O . X . . O . . X . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . 1 , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . X . . . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . . . O O X . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . X O X X . . . X . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . X . O O . . . . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . X O O O . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , . . . X O X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . O . . . . . X O X O O . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . X . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . X X O . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X X . . . . X . . O . |
$$ | . . X X X O . O O X . . . . O X X O . |
$$ | . X O O X O . . . X . . X X X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . X O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]
I really thought about cutting at G14 but among other moves, including a counter cut at K13, it seemed that if White plays simply H16 still more of my stones would get cut off in a capturing race. After seeing some variations in Attack and Defense, I'm thinking of going back to add new insights to some of my earlier options. In particular, I saw another possible way of responding to the peep that got me into so much trouble!

Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2014 9:40 pm
by EdLee
Go is full of surprises. I was reading forever the variations in post 234 versus the variations here:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X O . X . . O . . X . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . X . 2 . . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . . 1 O O X . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . X O X X . . . X . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . X . O O . . . . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . X O O O . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , . . . X O X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . O . . . . . X O X O O . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . X . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . X X O . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X X . . . . X . . O . |
$$ | . . X X X O . O O X . . . . O X X O . |
$$ | . X O O X O . . . X . . X X X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . X O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]
( Local time Mon Dec 08, 2014. 12:40 pm. )

Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2014 9:45 pm
by EdLee
Hi Aidoneus, I'm 29k when it comes to drinks.
There must be some trade offs between the whiskey killing the germs and knocking you out. :)

Photo:
Keep warm. :)
image.jpg
image.jpg (92.9 KiB) Viewed 10307 times
( Local time Mon Dec 08, 2014. 1:47 pm. )

Re: #244 Bill vs Ed

Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 3:31 am
by Uberdude
An excellent move from Aidoneus. :clap:

But let's see if he can follow it up correctly...

Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 11:36 pm
by EdLee
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wm101
$$ -----------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X O . X . . O . . X . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . X , . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . O X O O . X . . 1 . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . . . O O X . . . . . . X O . |
$$ | . O X . . X O X X . . . X . . O O . . |
$$ | . . . X . O O . . . . . . . X X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . X O O O . . |
$$ | . . O X . X . . . , . . . X O X . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . O . . . . . X O X O O . . |
$$ | . O X O O . . . . . . . . . X X O . . |
$$ | . X X X . . . . X . . . . . . X . . . |
$$ | . . . . X . X X O . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . O X X . . . . X . . O . |
$$ | . . X X X O . O O X . . . . O X X O . |
$$ | . X O O X O . . . X . . X X X O O . . |
$$ | . . . . O . O . . . . . . X O . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]
( Local time Tue Dec 09, 2014. 2:36 pm. )
All times are UTC-07:00
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