Life In 19x19

John Fairbairn wrote:Be reassured, he was being nothing but complimentary. In such cases sasuga desu just means, "Wow, I'm impressed!" or "That's fantastic" and means essentially the same as sugoi or subarashii.

So Shibano is still a sweetheart. Thanks for the lesson.

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ez4u wrote:Otake Yu is not only younger than Fujisawa, he is also 1 month younger than Ueno. On mamumamu's rating list as of the end of July, he is higher rated than either of them. Interestingly, on that list, Ueno Asami has caught up to Fujisawa Rina. They are ranked 32nd and 31st respectively. Otake is ranked 25th. Murakawa is 8th by the way.

I don't look at rankings but wow, Murakawa is really that strong huh? And I knew Takao was still strong (being in the leagues also) but I didn't know he was also so high up.

I'm also surprised that Hane Naoki and Kono Rin are lower... So who is higher than expected? I guess Onishi Ryuhei, Motoki Katsuya, and Sun Zhe, I'm only barely familiar with them.

...speaking of Motoki, he is the commentator of the women's Honinbo semi-final match between Ueno Asami and Nakamura Sumire: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikXASy0TaQk

There is no live stream (or date) announced for Rina's Honinbo match. Please share the news if anyone sees that it will happen.

Today I found a long article and a 50 minute podcast about "sasuga" (Shibano's tweet about Rina's win) and I guess I'll just need to pay attention to it's uses. As with many things, context is important.

https://www.tofugu.com/japanese-grammar/sasuga/

Today I found a long article and a 50 minute podcast about "sasuga" (Shibano's tweet about Rina's win) and I guess I'll just need to pay attention to it's uses. As with many things, context is important.

1. One way Japanese linguists use to explain sasuga to themselves is to propose that it derives from classical 'shika suru ga', meaning 'it is so, but/and...' In other words, it has no real meaning of its own and so no direct connection with the speaker's meaning which really lies in the '...' part. Sasuga is thus, at heart, a communication cue. This could be seen as a way of saying it's the context that matters, which is true but needs the rider that the context includes things like intonation and social norms.

2. I forget the precise details now, but many years ago Prof. Roy Miller got irritated by a passage of Japanese by a famous author he was reading. He thought it was gibberish. He therefore asked some Japanese people what they thought of the piece. They all said complimentary things like "very beautiful" or "most profound." He remained unconvinced and wrote either a very long article or a small book about it. I think he fell into the common trap of assuming the piece had to have a meaning, whereas it can be enough for it to suggest a meaning. Tis occurs in other languages, but literary Japanese in particular can often be like haiku on steroids. It then helps immensely if you are a native speaker and easily share the social norms.

3. Another common trap is to assume that Japanese is so different from any other language that it is 'alien.' The aspect that I have noticed most is that Japanese is supposedly unique, or at least unusual, in having different languages for males and females. Well, I suppose it does, but it's not unusual. All languages have that feature. I can remember my own interest in languages being sparked as a tiny tot when noticing that my mother and father spoke in different ways (and, of course, children speak in different ways, too).

4. So, there is no need to assume that the various usages of sasuga make Japanese in any way unique. A passable equivalent of the same phenomenon can be found in the English word 'nice'. If someone says just, 'Nice' it can mean 'beautifully played' or 'what a perfect mess you've left me in' or a host of other wildly different things that any native speaker can dream up with varying contexts and intonations. This is another lesson I learned as a tiny tot. My primary school teacher would remind us almost daily: "nice is not nice."

John Fairbairn wrote:1. One way Japanese linguists use to explain sasuga to themselves is to propose that it derives from classical 'shika suru ga', meaning 'it is so, but/and...' In other words, it has no real meaning of its own and so no direct connection with the speaker's meaning which really lies in the '...' part.

Yes... I'll have to be more care. I didn't realize how often this might be happening. I've only learned the beginner's example: "chotto..."

John Fairbairn wrote:3. Another common trap is to assume that Japanese is so different from any other language that it is 'alien.'

I actually get surprised often by how many times a silly or figurative phrase in English has a direct transaction in Japanese. "In front of my eyes" == "me no mae" (目の前). That's the only one I can remember offhand but it happens often. Though I learned that saying "go to bed" doesn't work in Japanese, it should be "go to sleep."

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Well, back to Rina, I hope she makes it to the main battle. As for Shibano, he won the Kisei S-league. There will still be the final rounds to decide the challenger.

ez4u wrote:

Harleqin wrote:If I remember correctly, Otake Yu is responsible for stopping Amazons short in at least two recent major tournaments, so I wouldn't dismiss him as easy in any way. I think he is also comparably young.

Otake Yu is not only younger than Fujisawa, he is also 1 month younger than Ueno. On mamumamu's rating list as of the end of July, he is higher rated than either of them. Interestingly, on that list, Ueno Asami has caught up to Fujisawa Rina. They are ranked 32nd and 31st respectively. Otake is ranked 25th. Murakawa is 8th by the way.

Well in world rankings Ueno Asami is above Fujisawa Sensei . . .

CDavis7M wrote: . . .


I don't look at rankings but wow, Murakawa is really that strong huh? And I knew Takao was still strong (being in the leagues also) but I didn't know he was also so high up.

I'm also surprised that Hane Naoki and Kono Rin are lower... So who is higher than expected? I guess Onishi Ryuhei, Motoki Katsuya, and Sun Zhe, I'm only barely familiar with them.

...speaking of Motoki, he is the commentator of the women's Honinbo semi-final match between Ueno Asami and Nakamura Sumire: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikXASy0TaQk

There is no live stream (or date) announced for Rina's Honinbo match. Please share the news if anyone sees that it will happen.

Murakawa Daisuke is the strongest pro from the Kansai Kiin.

I don't have much to add to the Japanese discussion, sorry I just wanted to say that, in manga translations, I read often "as expected of...!". It makes me think that Shibano's expression must be very common, and that the easy translation is not always the best.

About Murakawa vs. Fujisawa:

I was surprised she won! but made me really happy. Murakawa is 9-dan, and the ratings might say this or that. But to me, there is something that somehow has been missed here: he plays in the Kisei S league. That's his level, and that's the level of Rina's accomplishement. Otake Yu is going to be hard, of course, and he already beat her in the Tengen just a couple of months ago. But she has a decent chance. Let's see what happens.

Hey everyone, Rina's Honinbo game to qualify for the final league is live now. Good luck to her.

https://youtu.be/yfKeNKOpX3Y

I think Tsuruyama is also playing to make the league today. Good luck to him too.


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Results of the YouTube chat poll:

Who are you rooting for?

Fujisawa Rina 5 Dan (84%)
Otake Yu 6 Dan (8%)
Nishioka Masasuke 3 Dan (Record Keeper) (7%)

Well, that's a bummer. I didn't check with AI but there were a few moments earlier and in the decisive fight where the on-stream graph moved a lot. https://www.nihonkiin.or.jp/match_news/ ... aisyu.html

I like that we get to see the post game review with variations. Even better when the board is a mess and they push the stones to the side in a big jumble. It's fun to watch. I wonder what word they use for this.

Yeah, bummer.

I couldn't follow all the game. Until I could watch it (white, Otake, was trying to make life on the right), it was more or less even, perhaps black a little ahead. White was quite ahead for some time, but black was able to catch up again. But black was never very ahead.

Then I had to stop, because of work (work sucks too!), and when I had the chance to check, it was nearly over but white was about to win.

It's a real pity. Would have been great to have General Fujisawa break into man's land.

I hope it won't be long before an Amazon claims a seat in one of the big leagues.

Well, congratulations to Rina on making it to the Judan main tournament. She and Ueno were in it last year where she won the first round and lost the second. She'll be in there with Iyama, Ichiriki, Ida Atsushi, Takao Shinji (beat Ueno). Who else... I like Rin Kanketsu and he's in there. Murakawa Daisuke. Hoshiai Shiho didn't make it.

Looks like Yo Seiko, Shibano Toramaru, Sada Atsushi, and Adachi Toshimasa (forgot about him) will be seeded in.

I hope that Rina plays Rin Kanketsu or Yo Seiki. She is such a fan favorite that she'll probably get a video broadcast with commentary.

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Revealing more of my hopes and dreams, I hope that Nyu Eiko gets to be on the cover of Go World 月刊碁ワールド for her SENKO Cup win. The magazine articles are a few months delayed and I think October would be her chance. The announcement should be coming next week I think. :fingers crossed:
https://www.nihonkiin.or.jp/publishing/go_world/

CDavis7M wrote:Well, congratulations to Rina on making it to the Judan main tournament. She and Ueno were in it last year where she won the first round and lost the second. She'll be in there with Iyama, Ichiriki, Ida Atsushi, Takao Shinji (beat Ueno). Who else... I like Rin Kanketsu and he's in there. Murakawa Daisuke. Hoshiai Shiho didn't make it.

Looks like Yo Seiko, Shibano Toramaru, Sada Atsushi, and Adachi Toshimasa (forgot about him) will be seeded in.

I hope that Rina plays Rin Kanketsu or Yo Seiki. She is such a fan favorite that she'll probably get a video broadcast with commentary.

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Revealing more of my hopes and dreams, I hope that Nyu Eiko gets to be on the cover of Go World 月刊碁ワールド for her SENKO Cup win. The magazine articles are a few months delayed and I think October would be her chance. The announcement should be coming next week I think. :fingers crossed:
https://www.nihonkiin.or.jp/publishing/go_world/

She's already played Rin Kanketsu in the NHK cup a while ago, with Cho Chikun Commenting.

Elom0 wrote:She's already played Rin Kanketsu in the NHK cup a while ago, with Cho Chikun Commenting.

Thanks for the tip. I see it was not this season. Unfortunately I don't see a way to easily view NHK Cup games. I'll just hold out for the YouTube steam.

CDavis7M wrote:

Elom0 wrote:She's already played Rin Kanketsu in the NHK cup a while ago, with Cho Chikun Commenting.

Thanks for the tip. I see it was not this season. Unfortunately I don't see a way to easily view NHK Cup games. I'll just hold out for the YouTube steam.

Ahh . . .

Lin Kanketsu v Fujisawa Rina, Commentary by Cho Chikun

Oh my, they are young!

The Army will have a new recruit soon.

Saki Yanagihara, 11 yo, has been choosed as a new pro. Choosed, because she hasn't passed the pro exam. She comes from the NK talent search program (or however it's called). She already says that she wants to be Sumire's rival. Good luck.

Sumire was the first recruit, but there has been others, like Tsuji Hana. But I find a couple of things odd.

Yanagihara will be a full pro starting April. But starting January, she will be "a trainning pro", or something like that. This is new. Sumire, and others, began in April their year, as shodan, and that's all. Fujita Reo (9), from the Kansai Kiin, will start as a pro soon too. But at first (while shodan), like a semi-pro, then full pro (after becoming 2 dan).

Is there some kind of battle between the Kiin's, to show that they have the best children, they can find younger talents, and so on? It makes me wonder how they are using children. Sumire is doing ok now, but let's remember the big pressure she had from the media at first. Now the pressure is not better, but she can handle it.

Yanagihara, at least, could speak in the press conference.