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Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2014 11:57 pm
by EdLee
Uberdude wrote: Twice tj86430 makes the same shape mistake
$$B
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$B6 is better to capture.
Same mistake with the ponnuki the other way round here, 6 should capture:
$$B
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$B(
For beginners. )
$$B
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$B$$B
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$B(
For beginners. )
It's tricky to know when to ponnuki and when to connect.
Like many other aspects in Go, this is not an either-or situation.
Rather, it's more like a continuum:
People around 10 kyu have their understanding of this;
people around 1 dan have their understanding of this;
higher dan people have their understanding of this, and so on.
Re: #237 DJLLAP vs tj86430
Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2014 7:11 am
by tj86430
$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0BTW, I'm delighted that we have so many high-caliber kibitzers
Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2014 9:10 am
by EdLee
tj86430 wrote: $$Wcm21
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wcm21I really don't know what's best here, but this seems quite natural. I think he needs to jump too (or play something like P13), otherwise I believe I can kill his invasion. Then I can perhaps make my corner a bit more secure with Q18.
W can already consider attacking with (a), etc.
Re: #237 DJLLAP vs tj86430
Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2014 7:30 pm
by DJLLAP
Re: #237 DJLLAP vs tj86430
Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2014 1:48 pm
by DJLLAP
$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0
Re: #237 DJLLAP vs tj86430
Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2014 2:07 pm
by Uberdude
With the top side joseki white often exchanges the two marked stones if he wants to attack the top right corner. Obviously white loses out in the top left corner with this exchange (but doesn't need to answer, the aji of black at
a is resistable with g16 and cut though white is thin here so black can easily come into the left with c14 for example) but gains power on the right, fixing the black wedge at n15.
$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0Normally the wedge goes like this which connects black's corner and top groups with white building thickness (I took away a few stones to make it simple) (note that white can still just live with top right 3-3 but additional black stones on the right could make it killable):
$$Bcm1 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm1 Black: 0 , White: 0Now it could be that the top right corner is under such a severe attack white could consider exchanging like this but that's a big gamble and the corner had better die after white gets broken in the centre. I showed just some vaguely plausible continuation on the right to get the corner weak
$$Wcm25 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wcm25 Black: 0 , White: 0$$Wcm35 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wcm35 Black: 0 , White: 0Of course if the wedge at 34 means the corner dies black can just answer to make his corner live (r13 is quite a problem, maybe 33 needed to defend that).
Re: #237 DJLLAP vs tj86430
Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 9:48 am
by tj86430
Thinking...
At first I was going to play this:
$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0But then I started wondering whether I could cut after all:
$$Bcm1 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm1 Black: 0 , White: 0After this there a plenty of choices, and I have a hard time figuring out whether some of them are really bad for me.
This might be problematic:
$$Bcm1 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm1 Black: 0 , White: 0perhaps this would be ok continuation:
$$Bcm1 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm1 Black: 0 , White: 0White gets a huge upper center, but I get very large left side and although my moyo takes a hit I have respectable lower left as well. Perhaps I have to count a bit.
But white may choose this instead:
$$Bcm1 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Bcm1 Black: 0 , White: 0Who will come out ahead?
Re: #237 DJLLAP vs tj86430
Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 10:50 am
by Bill Spight
Re: #237 DJLLAP vs tj86430
Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2014 1:22 am
by tj86430
$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0
Re: #237 DJLLAP vs tj86430
Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 9:40 am
by DJLLAP
$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0Sorry about the delay. I am in the midst of moving and selling half of my stuff, so I might not be as regular for a couple of weeks.
Re: #237 DJLLAP vs tj86430
Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 11:41 am
by tj86430
$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0No problem. I just started my vacation, so in theory I have a lot of time for this for about two weeks (then I'm off to a couple of trips), but in practice vacation can be a lot more hectic than work...
Re: #237 DJLLAP vs tj86430
Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 1:57 pm
by Uberdude
Re: #237 DJLLAP vs tj86430
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 4:46 am
by tj86430
@Uberdude
Uberdude wrote: p9 would be a mistake. Can you find how white would take advantage? There was another good move for black here though.
On thing that comes to my mind is this:
$$Wcm1 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wcm1 Black: 0 , White: 0Which means B would have to play 2 @ 3.
Might the other good move for B be this:
$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0
Re: #237 DJLLAP vs tj86430
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 5:06 am
by Uberdude
Re: #237 DJLLAP vs tj86430
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 5:05 pm
by DJLLAP
$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0
I'm not sure what the best course was here. All of the below points were considered. I decided to go with "A" because it makes me feel safe and warm.
$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0
Click Here To Show Diagram Code [go]$$Wcm21 Black: 0 , White: 0
