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Re: Re:
Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 2:58 pm
by Boidhre
Bill Spight wrote:Well, since the original proverb is
Don't look. Hane at the head of two stones, or
Without looking, hane at the head of two stones, my guess is that it applies a lot of the time.
Maybe Dave Sigaty will do a database search for us.
A database search will be problematic, it's a bit like the elephant eye shape: you see it a fair bit in pro games and beginner games, pros make it when they know playing on the vital point doesn't end well for their opponent, beginners don't notice they've made it.
Re: Re:
Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 4:15 pm
by Bill Spight
Boidhre wrote:Bill Spight wrote:Well, since the original proverb is
Don't look. Hane at the head of two stones, or
Without looking, hane at the head of two stones, my guess is that it applies a lot of the time.
Maybe Dave Sigaty will do a database search for us.
A database search will be problematic, it's a bit like the elephant eye shape: you see it a fair bit in pro games and beginner games, pros make it when they know playing on the vital point doesn't end well for their opponent, beginners don't notice they've made it.
There are a lot of good plays in the comments of pro games, precisely because the opponent avoided them.
Re: Re:
Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 6:44 pm
by Bantari
Bill Spight wrote:Bantari wrote:
Not sure, but at a guess - maybe 50% of the time? Just taking the number out of my hat, so it can be totally wrong. Might be actually less than that. Or more.
Well, since the original proverb is
Don't look. Hane at the head of two stones, or
Without looking, hane at the head of two stones, my guess is that it applies a lot of the time.
You are probably right, although I can think of quite a few standard (and non-standard) patters in which this proverb does not apply.
For example:
$$Bc
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . 4 5 . 2 . 3 . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . 6 1 . . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . a 7 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$
- Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc
$$ --------------------------------------
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . 4 5 . 2 . 3 . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . 6 1 . . . . . , . . . . . , . . .|
$$ |. . a 7 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$ |. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|
$$[/go]
Where 'a' instead of 7 is not advisable.
So, I think that you need at least look a little before applying any proverb. Even the one that says 'without looking.'
Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 6:59 pm
by EdLee
Bantari wrote:I think that you need at least look a little before applying any proverb.
Yes. Very deeply.