Big Brother Malkovich # 1 (continued)

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Re: Big Brother Malkovich # 1 (continued)

Post by Violence »

Not approved.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 35B - W: 18, B: 15
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . . X C , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . 1 O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I think it's clear why I can't let this move go.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 35B - W: 17, B: 15
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . . X 1 , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . . O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X 2 . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . 4 3 . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


It's because I feel this fight is very bad for black, and our heavy group comes under attack. Removing the liability of this group is our biggest concern.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 35B - W: 17, B: 15
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . . X . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . 1 O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . C . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This move seems key at first glance, but much reading is necessary to support it. I don't think white can resist this move without getting an unsatisfactory result. The outcome I predict is the following sequence:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 35B - W: 17, B: 15
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . 9 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O 7 6 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . 5 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O 3 2 X . , . . . . a , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . 1 O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . 0 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

And then white will approach the upper right corner at A. This is fine for us because we gained territory, have thickness in the center, exploitable aji on the left, and there is still play on the top. I feel that black is still playable, and in fact, comfortable here.
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Joaz Banbeck
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Re: Big Brother Malkovich # 1 (continued)

Post by Joaz Banbeck »

Joaz Banbeck wrote:... I think that black's best move is F15, and I will be very happy if Violence does not choose it.


Violence wrote:Not approved.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 35B - W: 18, B: 15
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . . X C , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . 1 O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]



I'm not happy. I do hope that Shapenaji has some clever tactical trick up his sleve, because our position looks strategically inferior to me.
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Chew Terr
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Re: Big Brother Malkovich # 1 (continued)

Post by Chew Terr »

Okay, I've been looking at this for a bit. Violence, you are scary. That move is intimidating. Also, congratulations on graduating!

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 36A - W: 18, B: 15
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . . X W , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Heh, being part of an open Malkovich game confused me. I almost forgot to hide my comments here. =D
Okay, so we have options here. The most obvious response, G16, will be cut.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc If I try to kill the cutting stone and connect, we die.
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . 7 5 6 . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . 2 3 4 . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O 1 W X . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

E18 looks at a glance like we might make a ko, but I feel like that would go against us, even if there is a ko.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc However, if we force the cutting stone out, we live small.
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O 6 . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . 2 3 5 . . 7 . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O 1 W X . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]


I'm not big on this because it gives black a lot to work with at the top, and cuts off our stone to float in the middle.

Well, when the normal things are unsatisfying, consider the weird stuff. Let's consider the plan that I'm tentatively calling 'Those stones are ugly, and I don't like them anyways'.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Wow, this is actually really tempting...
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . 3 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O 1 2 X W , . . 6 . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]

It exchanges five weak stones for one stable group. It gives more strength to two black groups, but one is alive and the other is strong already. Ah, but I think the flaw in my plan is that black wouldn't respond with 1 (because this diagram looks so okay for us).

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc After something like this, we can extend from the wall to attack the corner
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . 3 5 6 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O 2 1 X W , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . X O O 7 8 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . 9 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc The prior diagram is probably better, as it looks similar but has more ko threats and such.
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . 5 6. . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . 2 3 4 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O 7 1 X W , . . . 8 . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . |[/go]


In conclusion
I keep looking at it, and it looks to me that our top group is not worth saving. I think it's worth exchanging it for a more solid group on the outside. However, sacrificing and exchanging large groups requires more judgement than I have (I have way too many kyus for that). So while it looks better, I'm not at all confident about it. Joaz and Shape, sorry if I'm wrong, but I've got to go with what analysis I have.


Well, topazg, your point looked shiny and critical. I think I want it, if Violence doesn't.
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Joaz Banbeck
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Re: Big Brother Malkovich # 1 (continued)

Post by Joaz Banbeck »

Chew Terr wrote: ...when the normal things are unsatisfying, consider the weird stuff. Let's consider the plan that I'm tentatively calling 'Those stones are ugly, and I don't like them anyways'.


I think that I have just encountered the Hunter S. Thompson school of go. :roll:
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Joaz Banbeck
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Re: Big Brother Malkovich # 1 (continued)

Post by Joaz Banbeck »

I do not approve.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 36A - W: 18, B: 17
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . W X C , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I don't know what Shapenaji has in mind here, so I'm playing this on faith. Either he wants to live solidly but small up top and engage in a running battle with the fragments, or he wants to sacrifice the upper group and leave black overconcentrated in gote. Conveniently, I don't have to choose between those two right now; they are completely different strategies but the first move of each is the same.

If we want to live up top, it has to be done like this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O 7 . 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . 3 4 6 . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O 2 1 X . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


If we want to sacrifice, it should be done like this:

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . 6 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . 4 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O 2 1 X a , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Note that we do not play 'a' anywhere in this sequence, for the stone that it captures is a goner anyway. After 3 and 5, that black stone is too close to our newly built strength, and it is not worthwhile for black to try to save it. So by the logic of tewari analysis, if we don't need move #7 at 'a', we don't need move #1 there either.

When all is said and done, the first move is the same.
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Re: Big Brother Malkovich # 1 (continued)

Post by unkx80 »

Not for players.

Joaz Banbeck wrote:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . 6 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . 4 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O 2 1 X a , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Note that we do not play 'a' anywhere in this sequence, for the stone that it captures is a goner anyway. After 3 and 5, that black stone is too close to our newly built strength, and it is not worthwhile for black to try to save it. So by the logic of tewari analysis, if we don't need move #7 at 'a', we don't need move #1 there either.


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . 3 4 5 . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O 2 1 X 7 , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


If the aim is to sacrifice, then I think this sequence is better. Now, where should :b8: be played?
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Re: Big Brother Malkovich # 1 (continued)

Post by shapenaji »

Approved

See previous comments, I find the life here to be fine, we get a running fight in the center against their stones, but they still need a fix around "a", and 8 leaves us with great potential to reduce later on (they really don't have time to fix it)

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 36A - W: 18, B: 17
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . 8 . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O 6 . 4 7 . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . 2 3 5 . . a . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O 1 W X c , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


EDIT: I guess I should explain in more depth why I'm not particularly worried about those 3 stones. Are they floating? sure, but they're actually surprisingly difficult to attack without hurting either the left or the right side.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 36A - W: 18, B: 17
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . O X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O X O X . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X b X O O 1 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . 0 . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X 4 7 3 . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . a 6 5 9 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . 8 . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


next, if black plays "b", we play "a"

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Move 36A - W: 18, B: 17
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . O X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O X O X . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . X O O X . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . O . a . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . 0 X 1 9 X . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . 5 3 2 7 . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . 6 4 8 . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


and then we play "a" and are solid. There are many, many more variations here, but it seems like in every one we can get out and do damage.
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Re: Big Brother Malkovich # 1 (continued)

Post by Gresil »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 37A - W: 18, B: 17
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . O X . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 1 O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I see two urgent aims: pre-empt a white approach on the top right, and develop the center group. This move allows both:


Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bc Move 37A - W: 18, B: 17
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . C . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . O X 5 , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 1 O 3 . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . 2 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


:b5: might also be at the circled point.


Edit: I just realized that I didn't investigate the reasoning behind Violence's move at all—I merely looked at the present board and saw unappetizing shapes in that part. I'll try to be more attentive in the future.
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Re: Big Brother Malkovich # 1 (continued)

Post by Joaz Banbeck »

Gresil's move is aji keshi.

It is also, of course, not what Violence intended. :lol: F15 has to be followed by F16 eventually, or it is a wasted move. Topazg also wants to play on the top side.

It will be interesting to see if this gets corrected. In my estimation, it is not a loss of 2 points, and Topazg should let it ride.
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Re: Big Brother Malkovich # 1 (continued)

Post by topazg »

Approved.

It's aji-keshi, and I don't like it, but White must respond and I'm not sure if Black has lost two points for the exchange or not - I feel maybe not, and besides I don't want to keep correcting everything.

However, there is a risk that gresil will keep playing "elsewhere", so a correction may be needed soon anyway
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Re: Big Brother Malkovich # 1 (continued)

Post by Dusk Eagle »

This is a case of the 1-2-3 principle: Why not directly play Gresil's move :b3: instead of making the :b1: :w2: exchange which is clearly beneficial for white?

I'm not saying that :b3: is necessarily good, but if it is going to be played, it should be played without this weird :b1: :w2: exchange first.
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Re: Big Brother Malkovich # 1 (continued)

Post by Violence »

Throw in for forcing moves? Yeah, I think I can get behind that. I just hope he follows through with the cut soon.


Approved.
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Re: Big Brother Malkovich # 1 (continued)

Post by Chew Terr »

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Wc Move 38A - W: 18, B: 17
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X O O . O X . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . X O X . X O O . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X O . . . . . , . . . . . , . . . |
$$ | . . W . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . X . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . O . . . , . . . . . O . . . |
$$ | . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Okay, we have enough liberties to cleanly capture the cutting stone. I think next, black will put us into atari again from on top, to build more center thickness. That said, I don't like the looks of atari-ing from the west, nor do I like our group's odds if I play anywhere else. So this move seems forced to me, and I expect E10 next. If I'm right about that, I plan to capture directly to remove that aji. That lets black connect their lower group out in gote, but there's not a lot I'm willing to do about that. If we get sealed in, we may need to start considering B14 for eyespace.
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Move #38B

Post by Joaz Banbeck »

I approve.

As Terr says, it is forced. This runs the black stone into the side of the board and kills it with just one liberty to spare. Any other move gets our group killed.

I'm glad to read that Terr has noted that B14 is good for getting eyes. He didn't explicitly say that it is sente to kill the upper left corner, but I think that he noticed that.

So I have no worries here. I'm just going to prop up my feet and let Terr win this for us.
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Re: Big Brother Malkovich # 1 (continued)

Post by shapenaji »

Approved
As my compatriots said, forced
Tactics yes, Tact no...
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