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112. joppon v Marcus

https://www.lifein19x19.com/viewtopic.php?t=3626

Page 7 of 9

Re: 112. joppon v Marcus

Posted: Fri Jun 10, 2011 3:39 am
by joppon
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm61 Prisoner Count: :b1: :white:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . 7 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Strange move. First I thought it aimed at the push 'a' and cut, but black has the ladder. Then I thought about the tennuki at 'b', but that leaves white with a massive wall on the left side (with B crawling painfully to make life) and the capture of the :bc: stones. As it is W66 results in my strengthening my position, not only locally but globally as well. It also increases my potential territory. If white responds directly, as - I believe - he should do I'll take 'b'. Though I guess it depends on how direct the response.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm61 Prisoner Count: :b1: :white:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X a X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . B B B O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . 7 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . b . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: 112. joppon v Marcus

Posted: Fri Jun 10, 2011 3:58 am
by joppon
I think 'a' and 'b' are miai.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm61 Prisoner Count: :b1: :white:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . 7 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . a , . . . . . b . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . . . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: 112. joppon v Marcus

Posted: Fri Jun 10, 2011 5:09 am
by Marcus
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm61 Prisoner Count: :b1: :white:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . , . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . 8 . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Now that my group isn't easily squeezed, I'll move over to the largest part of the board.

Why low? Well, there's very little development space towards the bottom left due to his shimari. At some point, he'll likely jump into my 3-5 corner. I should be able to lean on him a bit and build a wall ... and K3 seems to be a nice place for a long extension, and Black can't undercut me as easily as if I had played K4.

Of course, I might want to pincer any approach to my 3-5 ... it all depends on my global understanding of the position, I guess. As I've mentioned in my Study Journal, however ... my strategizing always seems to suck ... here goes nothing! :D

Re: 112. joppon v Marcus

Posted: Fri Jun 10, 2011 7:47 am
by Laman
Marcus wrote:...

Why low? Well, there's very little development space towards the bottom left due to his shimari. At some point, he'll likely jump into my 3-5 corner. I should be able to lean on him a bit and build a wall ... and K3 seems to be a nice place for a long extension, and Black can't undercut me as easily as if I had played K4.

...


i would prefer playing high, because limiting black influence spreading all over the right-center is worth more than securing a bit more points on the lower side. this way black can happily press white down and build a really big moyo. though i admit that it also depends on what will happen with R11-R10 stones, where white can possibly break into black influence

black's overall position looks better to me

Re: 112. joppon v Marcus

Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2011 1:58 am
by joppon
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm61 Prisoner Count: :b1: :white:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . 9 . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


This is difficult for me. If 'a' and 'b' are miai, then I guess I should respond to W68 at somewhere like 'c'? But my instinct - or my style - tells me to attack W68 with something like 'a'.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm61 Prisoner Count: :b1: :white:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . c . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . b , . . . . . a . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . 8 . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Diag 2
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm01 Prisoner Count: :b1: :white:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . , . 3 . . . . 1 . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Oooh, very pretty! :)

Re: 112. joppon v Marcus

Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2011 8:53 am
by Kirby
I kind of prefer something simple:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm61 Prisoner Count:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . B , . . . . . . . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: 112. joppon v Marcus

Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 4:56 am
by Marcus
Sorry! Been sick.

Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm61 Prisoner Count: :b1: :white:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 0 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Yeah, yeah, ignoring the contact play ... got a few ideas, a few things to try out ...

Re: 112. joppon v Marcus

Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 2:55 am
by joppon
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm71 Prisoner Count: :b1: :white:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , 1 . . . . X . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


All other options in that area seem no good. Which means that my instincts are good. :) Perhaps I'll soon reach 2D. ;-) I think that my influence is almost overwhelming, and if I were to further add to it the game would be very difficult for white. Even more so than it's going to be. Since at some point, white will have to step into the centre. At which point I will attempt to kill everything that white has there. However, since white already has 2 of the 4 corners I feel almost obliged (for reasons of balance) to at least make him work to take the third.

Assuming white fights for the corner...
Diag 1
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm01 Prisoner Count: :b1: :white:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 7 2 1 . . . . X . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . 4 3 O 0 . . . O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . 6 5 9 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Diag 2a
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm01 Prisoner Count: :b1: :white:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 7 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 8 2 1 . . . . X . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . 4 3 O 9 . . . O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . 6 5 0 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Diag 2b. Weakness at 'a'.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm01 Prisoner Count: :b1: :white:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X a . . . X . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . O X O X . . . O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O X O 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Diag 2b var
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm01 Prisoner Count: :b1: :white:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . X . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . . . X . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . O X O X . . . O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . O X O 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Diag 3. No good for my plans, even if black lives.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm01 Prisoner Count: :b1: :white:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 6 . 9 0 . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 4 1 3 8 . . . X . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . 5 2 O . . . . O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . 7 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Diag 3 var. No good for black.
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm01 Prisoner Count: :b1: :white:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . 5 6 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . 8 4 1 3 0 . . . X . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . 7 2 O 9 . . . O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]

Re: 112. joppon v Marcus

Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 4:35 am
by Aphelion
Maybe I'm too weak to know what I'm talking about. But if two contact plays were not urgent enough to follow up on on either side, should it have been played at all? White seems to be saying that Black's last two plays were not sente, and Black seems to be agreeing with him.

Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 5:52 am
by EdLee
Aphelion,
Yes, naturally B wants to hane :b1: since W tenuki:
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . , . . . . . X . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . 1 O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]

Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 6:05 am
by EdLee
joppon (after the game),
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$B
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . b , . . . . . a . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . W . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ -----------------------------------------[/go]
joppon wrote:If 'a' and 'b' are miai...
(a) and (b) are not miai. :black:(b) is a big move, while :black:(a) is... strange. :)
joppon wrote:my style... tells me to attack :wc: with something like 'a'.
Given the board, you can not attack :wc:, and even if you wanted to, (a) is not the right move.
(a) = attach; general idea: don't touch your target weak group (but :wc: is not your target!).
Also, this has nothing to do with your style. :) It's about attack (strategy) and contact plays (tactics).

Re: 112. joppon v Marcus

Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2011 1:30 am
by joppon
EdLee, this game will probably last for another 130 moves. At least. Leaving me to wonder the entire time. So cruel. :lol:

Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2011 6:03 am
by EdLee
joppon, maybe it's OK after the lower half of the board is completely settled. :)
If the situation changes enough that you can read it, I'll let you know at the right time. :mrgreen:

Re: 112. joppon v Marcus

Posted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 2:02 pm
by Marcus
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm71 Prisoner Count:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . 2 X . . . . X . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . . O . . . . O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


Big corner? lots of unsettled positions on the board.

Re: 112. joppon v Marcus

Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 1:56 am
by joppon
Click Here To Show Diagram Code
[go]$$Bcm71 Prisoner Count: :b1: :white:
$$ ---------------------------------------
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . X X . . O . . . . . |
$$ | . . O O X . . X X O O O . . . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X . . X O , . . O O . X O . . |
$$ | . . O X X O . O O . . O X X X . . . . |
$$ | . O . O X . O . . O O X . . . . O . . |
$$ | . O O O X X O . X . X X . . . . . . . |
$$ | . X X X O O X X . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . X O O . . . , . . . . . , O . . |
$$ | . . . X . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . X . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . O X . . . . X . . . . . , X . . |
$$ | . . . 3 O . . . . O . . . . X . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
$$ ---------------------------------------[/go]


I cannot see any bad variations for black. But let's wait and see what Marcus does.
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